A watt is a watt is a watt!!!!!!!!
11-17-2004, 10:00 AM
#1
1000 Watt CAFz'r
Thread Starter
Join Date: Oct 2003
Posts: 1,783
Well, I've been in hiding for a while lurking. And then I see this flurry of people on various forums refering to PEAK power!
Hello?
Peak power is a marketing tool derived by advertising departments, NOT engineers. It simply does not exist in physics.
First, 1 watt = 1 joule of energy measured across 1 second in time. (A joule is the amount of energy needed to lift 1 Lb about 9 inches.)
Maybe I need caps for this:
A WATT IS MEASURED ACROSS 1 SECOND IN TIME.
Hello?
Peak power is a marketing tool derived by advertising departments, NOT engineers. It simply does not exist in physics.
First, 1 watt = 1 joule of energy measured across 1 second in time. (A joule is the amount of energy needed to lift 1 Lb about 9 inches.)
Maybe I need caps for this:
A WATT IS MEASURED ACROSS 1 SECOND IN TIME.
11-17-2004, 10:12 AM
#2
1000 Watt CAFz'r
Thread Starter
Join Date: Oct 2003
Posts: 1,783
Considering a 20hz tone is in fact 20 wave forms per second, how exactly is measuring the peak voltage of ONE of these wave forms scientific?
Watts RMS is the average power delivered across 1 second in time.(RMS standing for Route Mean Squared)
So you've got an amplifier that says 1000 watts on the front. That's great. In the lab, according to the marketing department, it can produce the equivelant voltage that is properly measured across one second, into ONE waveform. That's your peak power folks, and the rest of the time, (as in the other 19 cycles of that 20hz) it's pushing a real world 200 watts RMS.
Peak power is for NINIES!
Adam
Watts RMS is the average power delivered across 1 second in time.(RMS standing for Route Mean Squared)
So you've got an amplifier that says 1000 watts on the front. That's great. In the lab, according to the marketing department, it can produce the equivelant voltage that is properly measured across one second, into ONE waveform. That's your peak power folks, and the rest of the time, (as in the other 19 cycles of that 20hz) it's pushing a real world 200 watts RMS.
Peak power is for NINIES!
Adam
11-17-2004, 11:00 AM
#3
Nice rant 
[img]graemlins/thumb.gif[/img]
As someone whose occupation is marketing though, I think that peak power is pure genius. It just goes to show you how few consumers are actually informed and how easily their purchasing decisions can be influenced.
[ November 17, 2004, 12:03 PM: Message edited by: Kool ]
[img]graemlins/thumb.gif[/img] As someone whose occupation is marketing though, I think that peak power is pure genius. It just goes to show you how few consumers are actually informed and how easily their purchasing decisions can be influenced.
[ November 17, 2004, 12:03 PM: Message edited by: Kool ]
11-17-2004, 11:51 AM
#4
Peak is always 2x RMS for a sinewave... saying 'peak' power dosen't exist in physics is not correct.. Joules/second is the base term in SI units... 1J in .o1seconds is still 100joules/second for the time frame...
It is worthwhile to know the dynamic abilty of your amp... most test do 10cyles at 1khz..
I think what stinks is arbatrally slapping a # on a amp without saying how it was derived..
It is worthwhile to know the dynamic abilty of your amp... most test do 10cyles at 1khz..
I think what stinks is arbatrally slapping a # on a amp without saying how it was derived..
11-17-2004, 11:51 AM
#5
Guest
Posts: n/a
We beat this one to death a while back, and I wrote a story on it in PAS..
You are right though, the time base for the measurement of power is 1-Watt.
In reality, I haven't been able to get much more out of an amp or head unit using a single cycle, so to me, there still isn't instantaneous power.
[ November 17, 2004, 01:03 PM: Message edited by: Dave_MacKinnon ]
You are right though, the time base for the measurement of power is 1-Watt.
In reality, I haven't been able to get much more out of an amp or head unit using a single cycle, so to me, there still isn't instantaneous power.
[ November 17, 2004, 01:03 PM: Message edited by: Dave_MacKinnon ]
11-17-2004, 12:04 PM
#6
50 Watt CAFz'r
Join Date: Mar 2003
Posts: 309
Originally posted by Haunz:
Peak is always 2x RMS for a sinewave... saying 'peak' power dosen't exist in physics is not correct.. Joules/second is the base term in SI units... 1J in .o1seconds is still 100joules/second for the time frame...
It is worthwhile to know the dynamic abilty of your amp... most test do 10cyles at 1khz..
I think what stinks is arbatrally slapping a # on a amp without saying how it was derived..
Peak is always 2x RMS for a sinewave... saying 'peak' power dosen't exist in physics is not correct.. Joules/second is the base term in SI units... 1J in .o1seconds is still 100joules/second for the time frame...
It is worthwhile to know the dynamic abilty of your amp... most test do 10cyles at 1khz..
I think what stinks is arbatrally slapping a # on a amp without saying how it was derived..
11-17-2004, 01:24 PM
#7
Guest
Posts: n/a
RMS voltage is generally considered to be 0.707 the peak voltage of the waveform.
Dave - were you gated down to 1kHz and loaded to just above where the outputs would smoke?
In reality - the number of watts you have is irrelevant. You either have enough or you do not.
Dave - were you gated down to 1kHz and loaded to just above where the outputs would smoke?
In reality - the number of watts you have is irrelevant. You either have enough or you do not.
11-17-2004, 01:43 PM
#8
Yankee
Join Date: Aug 2004
Posts: 219
I think companies can do whatever they want/say what they want as long as they say how they ggot there...Even the average person would raise suspicion about an add that says "1000W Peak at 20hz for 5% of the time..."
There just needs to be a STANDARD power/efficiency/THD ect. rating for ALL companies. They all need to be rated the same and then there would be no problems...
There just needs to be a STANDARD power/efficiency/THD ect. rating for ALL companies. They all need to be rated the same and then there would be no problems...
11-17-2004, 01:49 PM
#10
agreed, you can get a "200 watt rms" amp to beat the living **** out of a "800 watt mac power" amp.
usually this 4extreme is only covered when the 800 watt amp is sony. meaning its rms rating is 1/4 what it says.
usually this 4extreme is only covered when the 800 watt amp is sony. meaning its rms rating is 1/4 what it says.
