Subwoofers in Series?
11-04-2006, 05:51 PM
#31
Sorry, I was only trying to clarify Haunz response. No one has given a difnitive answer to my original post yet. Many have said that the JL audio article is correct and some have said not. Zoomer seems to be doing some great research into the subject but I still don't have an answer. I have also posed this question on another forum and will transfer any intresting responses here. Thanks to everyone who responded. it is valued.
11-05-2006, 11:44 AM
#32
Administrator
Join Date: Feb 2006
Posts: 16,855
But have you asked JL? They made the statement.
IMO you have been given plenty of answers but they have been clouded with replies from theorists and demands of imperical data from people not willing to conduct their own testing.
IMO you have been given plenty of answers but they have been clouded with replies from theorists and demands of imperical data from people not willing to conduct their own testing.
11-05-2006, 04:04 PM
#33
since I don't see much constructive this may be my last post on the topic...... Ill start it by quoting a post I found by Richard Clark (who literally wrote the book on the technical side of audio)
when asked about the negative effects of wiring seperate drivers in series RC states:
I will maintain that JL's example of back EMF with + and - terminals SHORTED is a fundamentally INCORRECT example........ (I might also add that this is the same company that claims a chassis weighing hundreds of Kg's is only equivalent to 4awg wire; running only 1vc and leaving the second open on a DVC sub will significantly change t/s; and running a DVC sub from a pair of stereo channels could damage the sub......)
There may be a smidgin of truth to one or more of these claims.... but for the most part they are wrong on more then one level......... IMO anyway
The fact remains that two drivers in a parallel or series connection MUST SEE THE SAME SIGNAL AT THE SAME TIME..... with two DVC subs rigged series or parallel for the same load the only thing that will change is how possible variations in inductance, capacitance, and resistance is added together into a complex impedance curve........
differences in fs,vas,Q, ect... are purley mechanical, and although they may influence electrical properties they are there no matter what you do..... and will influence mechanical and electrical behaviour no matter what you do.....
If some people can't wrap thier mind around that or would prefer to keep believing JL's line..... that is fine by me....... perhaps we may still agree on the notion that having two or more drivers with variences in electrical and mechanical paramaters is NOT IDEAL......... ( and in such a case a single driver system should be favoured ! )
when asked about the negative effects of wiring seperate drivers in series RC states:
there is NO PERFORMANCE DIFFERENCE even though there are lots of technovoodoo beliefs that exist on the subject
I will maintain that JL's example of back EMF with + and - terminals SHORTED is a fundamentally INCORRECT example........ (I might also add that this is the same company that claims a chassis weighing hundreds of Kg's is only equivalent to 4awg wire; running only 1vc and leaving the second open on a DVC sub will significantly change t/s; and running a DVC sub from a pair of stereo channels could damage the sub......)
There may be a smidgin of truth to one or more of these claims.... but for the most part they are wrong on more then one level......... IMO anyway
The fact remains that two drivers in a parallel or series connection MUST SEE THE SAME SIGNAL AT THE SAME TIME..... with two DVC subs rigged series or parallel for the same load the only thing that will change is how possible variations in inductance, capacitance, and resistance is added together into a complex impedance curve........
differences in fs,vas,Q, ect... are purley mechanical, and although they may influence electrical properties they are there no matter what you do..... and will influence mechanical and electrical behaviour no matter what you do.....
If some people can't wrap thier mind around that or would prefer to keep believing JL's line..... that is fine by me....... perhaps we may still agree on the notion that having two or more drivers with variences in electrical and mechanical paramaters is NOT IDEAL......... ( and in such a case a single driver system should be favoured ! )
Last edited by Haunz; 11-06-2006 at 01:13 PM.
11-06-2006, 02:26 PM
#35
Administrator
Join Date: Feb 2006
Posts: 16,855
Originally Posted by Haunz
The fact remains that two drivers in a parallel or series connection MUST SEE THE SAME SIGNAL AT THE SAME TIME.....
That is the whole point: the two drivers do NOT see the same signal when wired in series. You're unwilling to see that though.
Again, the real issue is how audible is it? I don't have an answer for that and would expect it to differ from system to system.
11-07-2006, 02:40 PM
#38
Administrator
Join Date: Feb 2006
Posts: 16,855
Oh oh - a better analogy since you likely won't appreciate the battery and lightbulb.
Based on your reasoning an inductor wired in series with a woofer will have NO EFFECT on the woofer because afterall an electron in = an electron out right...
Based on your reasoning an inductor wired in series with a woofer will have NO EFFECT on the woofer because afterall an electron in = an electron out right...
11-07-2006, 04:48 PM
#40
dukk your 'anologies' are neither here nor there.....
an inductor in series with a woofer will change its impedance curve - true enough.... but there is no way to get a singal to the woofer that dosen't pass through the inductor........ get the point ?
My electron in/electron out statment outlines the FACT that you cant put an electron into the first coil of a series setup without an electron leaving the second coil.......
The basis for the reasoning is very simple.......
I will reiterate it again....... two voice coils in series must see the exact same signal at the exact same time....... and I will stand by that.........
an inductor in series with a woofer will change its impedance curve - true enough.... but there is no way to get a singal to the woofer that dosen't pass through the inductor........ get the point ?
My electron in/electron out statment outlines the FACT that you cant put an electron into the first coil of a series setup without an electron leaving the second coil.......
The basis for the reasoning is very simple.......
I will reiterate it again....... two voice coils in series must see the exact same signal at the exact same time....... and I will stand by that.........
