How much power?
10-13-2003, 07:58 AM
#1
1000 Watt CAFz'r
Thread Starter
Join Date: Oct 2003
Posts: 1,783
Just thought that I'd poll to see how much power people are running to their front stage.
Just to give a point of reference, I"ve heard some absolutely spectacular sound from a 9 watt/ch tube amp. So I'm not thinking that bigger is nessarily better with you SQ guys.
So how much have you got?
My Audison VRx2.400 is rated at 200 watts/ch RMS, and I think that I've got more power than I need.(At least for sane listening levels)
Adam
Just to give a point of reference, I"ve heard some absolutely spectacular sound from a 9 watt/ch tube amp. So I'm not thinking that bigger is nessarily better with you SQ guys.
So how much have you got?
My Audison VRx2.400 is rated at 200 watts/ch RMS, and I think that I've got more power than I need.(At least for sane listening levels)
Adam
10-13-2003, 09:44 AM
#2
Guest
Posts: n/a
I used to run a Punch40 to my 3way front end - so about 40rms per side. It was alright but never had the impact I wanted. Now I run 2channels of a Punch 4080 (approx 90x2) and it's almost enuf.
Personally, 100watts RMS per side up front is my lower limit. Not so much for the volume it can reach but for the dynamics you retain at moderate levels.
Personally, 100watts RMS per side up front is my lower limit. Not so much for the volume it can reach but for the dynamics you retain at moderate levels.
10-13-2003, 10:01 AM
#3
Guest
Join Date: Aug 2003
Posts: 961
I have an Memphis 6 chanel runing my system. 75 per corner 150x150 ( 300 ) to my driver. Infiity referance components all around, rated at 150 per corner 300 at the driver. Sounds real good and very powerful. I've must have done somthing corectly it hasent blown up an sounds real good/ powerful.See you at Worlds! [img]graemlins/beer.gif[/img]
10-13-2003, 10:28 AM
#4
Guest
Posts: n/a
The Mazda I am doing will have 260 watts going to the mid and tweet and another 260 watts going to the midbass for a total of 520 rms to the front stage. I could bridge an amp one to the left and one to the right for about 900 watts rms but then I wouldn't be able to use the time alignment in the processor.
10-13-2003, 01:38 PM
#6
50 Watt CAFz'r
Join Date: Jul 2003
Posts: 96
Originally posted by PEI330Ci:
Just thought that I'd poll to see how much power people are running to their front stage.
Just to give a point of reference, I"ve heard some absolutely spectacular sound from a 9 watt/ch tube amp. So I'm not thinking that bigger is nessarily better with you SQ guys.
So how much have you got?
My Audison VRx2.400 is rated at 200 watts/ch RMS, and I think that I've got more power than I need.(At least for sane listening levels)
Adam
Just thought that I'd poll to see how much power people are running to their front stage.
Just to give a point of reference, I"ve heard some absolutely spectacular sound from a 9 watt/ch tube amp. So I'm not thinking that bigger is nessarily better with you SQ guys.
So how much have you got?
My Audison VRx2.400 is rated at 200 watts/ch RMS, and I think that I've got more power than I need.(At least for sane listening levels)
Adam
10-13-2003, 07:28 PM
#7
1000 Watt CAFz'r
Join Date: Dec 2002
Posts: 1,484
Originally posted by Dukk:
I used to run a Punch40 to my 3way front end - so about 40rms per side. It was alright but never had the impact I wanted. Now I run 2channels of a Punch 4080 (approx 90x2) and it's almost enuf.
Personally, 100watts RMS per side up front is my lower limit. Not so much for the volume it can reach but for the dynamics you retain at moderate levels.
I used to run a Punch40 to my 3way front end - so about 40rms per side. It was alright but never had the impact I wanted. Now I run 2channels of a Punch 4080 (approx 90x2) and it's almost enuf.
Personally, 100watts RMS per side up front is my lower limit. Not so much for the volume it can reach but for the dynamics you retain at moderate levels.
or do you have a formula you use like that? and what do you think of Focal components(not a huge fan of the Mb quart tweeter either, just incase they sound like that) [img]graemlins/dunno.gif[/img] Thanx [img]graemlins/thumb.gif[/img]
10-14-2003, 08:26 AM
#8
1000 Watt CAFz'r
Thread Starter
Join Date: Oct 2003
Posts: 1,783
Just a comment for any interested in Focal drivers. Having owned and used a great assortment of their product, I have some experience to share.
The build quality of Focal product is incredible. I was first exposed to them in 1992, and since that time I haven't seen any deviation in the quality of the product. Having literally tested hundreds(maybe thousands) of drivers, I can offer a qualified opinion of Focal's QC results. I used to get batches of 50 at a time to test before being used in product. The greatest deviation in frequency response for the batch of 50 was around +/- 1db.(not across the entire freq. range, but at one specific point) This is something that most people aren't aware of, but most drivers have a production tolerance when tested at the factory. Not just mechanical, but also when tested for freq. response and impedence. Better driver manufactures have tighter tolerances insuring the customer gets what they pay for. Focal doesn't do "B" drivers, they either make the spec or are trashed. That said, they very rarely trash a driver, and they don't sell product to other manufacturers.(As per the "Interesting thread")
As to the question about the sound of Focals, it deppends on how they are installed. But the raw kits when installed in a demo board are pretty neutral. The lower lines tend to have a bit warmer sound, while the top range kits(Utopias) are less warm but more detailed. The power handling of the Polykevlar and Utopia kits is pretty much the same, but the acoustic output at high volumes from the Utopia is far clearer. I used male tenor solos to test the sound of all the Focal car lines, and the Utopia kits are worth the price if you listen to this kind of music. Not everybody will push a driver that hard, but that's just my oppinion. I haven't done a direct apples to apples comparison between a Focal and MB Quart kit, so I'm not going to comment on the two. But I will say that the Focal (car audio)tweeters are a little hot for my taste, but they are very easy to tune. The great off-axis response helps you angle them
to suite your taste.
I have experience with drivers from many other manufactures including Dynaudio,Scan-Speak, Vifa, Audax, Morel, Seas, and Swans(China). Yes two of the above are the same manufacturer under a different marketing name for the U.S. market, but who can tell me which?
How does this relate to how much power you have driving your front stage? Manufacturers rated power handling. Focal and most of the others are pretty honest when they say 70 watts RMS for a 5.25" mid. You can put that much power to them all day every day and not get a falure.(Provided the amplifier isn't clipping)
So why put 300 watts on a 5.25" mid? It was said before... Dynamic Range. This is hard to believe, but most people only use about 1 to 5 watts of power when listening to music casually. But turn up the volume a bit while you're driving and you start to dip into your dynamic range.
Thats exactly what people refer to as "punch".
Although the rated power of my amp is 200w/ch, it puts out a bit more in the car. The spec was done at 12.0v with a conservative distortion limit at full frequency.(Pink noise) I think that most quality amps out there are like this. Although the difference between 200 and 272watts is just barely audible.(approx. 1.5db)
Now for the true audio purists out there, anybody else have an amp running pure Class "A"?
Adam
The build quality of Focal product is incredible. I was first exposed to them in 1992, and since that time I haven't seen any deviation in the quality of the product. Having literally tested hundreds(maybe thousands) of drivers, I can offer a qualified opinion of Focal's QC results. I used to get batches of 50 at a time to test before being used in product. The greatest deviation in frequency response for the batch of 50 was around +/- 1db.(not across the entire freq. range, but at one specific point) This is something that most people aren't aware of, but most drivers have a production tolerance when tested at the factory. Not just mechanical, but also when tested for freq. response and impedence. Better driver manufactures have tighter tolerances insuring the customer gets what they pay for. Focal doesn't do "B" drivers, they either make the spec or are trashed. That said, they very rarely trash a driver, and they don't sell product to other manufacturers.(As per the "Interesting thread")
As to the question about the sound of Focals, it deppends on how they are installed. But the raw kits when installed in a demo board are pretty neutral. The lower lines tend to have a bit warmer sound, while the top range kits(Utopias) are less warm but more detailed. The power handling of the Polykevlar and Utopia kits is pretty much the same, but the acoustic output at high volumes from the Utopia is far clearer. I used male tenor solos to test the sound of all the Focal car lines, and the Utopia kits are worth the price if you listen to this kind of music. Not everybody will push a driver that hard, but that's just my oppinion. I haven't done a direct apples to apples comparison between a Focal and MB Quart kit, so I'm not going to comment on the two. But I will say that the Focal (car audio)tweeters are a little hot for my taste, but they are very easy to tune. The great off-axis response helps you angle them
to suite your taste.
I have experience with drivers from many other manufactures including Dynaudio,Scan-Speak, Vifa, Audax, Morel, Seas, and Swans(China). Yes two of the above are the same manufacturer under a different marketing name for the U.S. market, but who can tell me which?
How does this relate to how much power you have driving your front stage? Manufacturers rated power handling. Focal and most of the others are pretty honest when they say 70 watts RMS for a 5.25" mid. You can put that much power to them all day every day and not get a falure.(Provided the amplifier isn't clipping)
So why put 300 watts on a 5.25" mid? It was said before... Dynamic Range. This is hard to believe, but most people only use about 1 to 5 watts of power when listening to music casually. But turn up the volume a bit while you're driving and you start to dip into your dynamic range.
Thats exactly what people refer to as "punch".
Although the rated power of my amp is 200w/ch, it puts out a bit more in the car. The spec was done at 12.0v with a conservative distortion limit at full frequency.(Pink noise) I think that most quality amps out there are like this. Although the difference between 200 and 272watts is just barely audible.(approx. 1.5db)
Now for the true audio purists out there, anybody else have an amp running pure Class "A"?
Adam
10-14-2003, 09:15 AM
#9
500 Watt CAFz'r
Join Date: Jul 2003
Posts: 756
My Xtant has an output of about 150 watts RMS @ 2 ohm stereo to my front stage. My chameleons are rated at 100 watts rms, but they seem to take the power without breaking a sweat. I must say that anything even close to full volume is far too loud for my tastes. My sub channel puts out around 300 watts rms @ 2ohms which is balanced very nicely in my setup. At 600 watts of total power, it can get pretty loud.
10-14-2003, 09:20 AM
#10
Cumulatively, my future setup will have 840 Watts RMS rated power for the entire front stage.
240 RMS for each 8" x 2 50-200Hz
100 RMS for each 5¼ x 2 200-2.4kHz
80 RMS for each 1" tweeter x 2 2.4-20kHz
We'll see how it goes.
240 RMS for each 8" x 2 50-200Hz
100 RMS for each 5¼ x 2 200-2.4kHz
80 RMS for each 1" tweeter x 2 2.4-20kHz
We'll see how it goes.
