Never thought I'd do this.. need help from the SQ guys!
08-27-2004, 05:32 AM
#1
No, I haven't changed over to the other side. I'm still all about SPL.. BUT I need a little bit of help from you guys.
I just picked up a PG Cyclone for my daily ride. I know that it is a very delicate piece, and if I don't treat it right she will take a crap on me.
So I guess I need to find out a bit more about what equipment to use, and get some recommendations from you guys.
So here is my questions.
The following quote is taken from the PG web site.
So, wtf is an active crossover, and how does it differ from a passive? (general terms, I don't need to know it all)
Next, can someone recommend a decent one?
I've noticed on the Audio Control web site that they have the 2XS/3XS.. ect. line. This seems like it would do the job, but I'm not sure.
I also know that AC can be a bit pricey. Is there a less expensive alternative?
Do they make an EQ/crossover combo type thing?
When I say "eq" I mean REALLY basic. My buddy had an AC 4.1 and that would probably be enough for me.
I have no idea how you guys handle a 30 band EQ. [img]graemlins/freak.gif[/img]
Basically.. I'm a moron. I need "moron" level equipment. I don't need extra bells and whistles because I wouldn't be smart enough to know how to use them.
But... at least I'm honest
[ August 27, 2004, 06:34 AM: Message edited by: JordyO ]
I just picked up a PG Cyclone for my daily ride. I know that it is a very delicate piece, and if I don't treat it right she will take a crap on me.
So I guess I need to find out a bit more about what equipment to use, and get some recommendations from you guys.
So here is my questions.
The following quote is taken from the PG web site.
Use only active crossovers. Never use passive crossovers with the Cyclone. Use a steep (minimum 18dB per octave) crossover between the mid-bass drivers and Cyclone. The crossover point should be no higher than 60Hz. You may even go as low as 50Hz. The idea is to make it impossible to tell where the Cyclone is physically located. The only way to do this is to keep frequencies that can be localized (above 50 - 60Hz) out of the Cyclone
Next, can someone recommend a decent one?
I've noticed on the Audio Control web site that they have the 2XS/3XS.. ect. line. This seems like it would do the job, but I'm not sure.
I also know that AC can be a bit pricey. Is there a less expensive alternative?
Do they make an EQ/crossover combo type thing?
When I say "eq" I mean REALLY basic. My buddy had an AC 4.1 and that would probably be enough for me.
I have no idea how you guys handle a 30 band EQ. [img]graemlins/freak.gif[/img]
Basically.. I'm a moron. I need "moron" level equipment. I don't need extra bells and whistles because I wouldn't be smart enough to know how to use them.
But... at least I'm honest
[ August 27, 2004, 06:34 AM: Message edited by: JordyO ]
08-27-2004, 05:54 AM
#2
Guest
Posts: n/a
the easiest thing to do would be to get a audio control 24xs, 24db/octave, get or make a 50hz x-over chip for it, change the subsonic chip to 20hz from the factory 33hz. i have sold a few cyclones over the years and still have the ported(dukk will lke it ) design saved. if you need some help with a box, i could email you the box parameters, but i will warn you now, its BIG, that baby need a big box, almost 4 cubic ft. do you know what generation cyclone you got, what do the vanes, the paddle looking things look like they are made of, this is a good indicator of what generation yo have
) design saved. if you need some help with a box, i could email you the box parameters, but i will warn you now, its BIG, that baby need a big box, almost 4 cubic ft. do you know what generation cyclone you got, what do the vanes, the paddle looking things look like they are made of, this is a good indicator of what generation yo have
08-27-2004, 06:00 AM
#3
1000 Watt CAFz'r
Join Date: May 2002
Posts: 1,649
Lots of choices on the market for active cross-overs beyond Audio Control as well. Just about everyone has something now. Check in with your local shop........ you'll likely get a ton of options, with some better then others.
Basically, an active cross-over allows you to change the cross-over point(s) across a set frequency band where as a passive, the cross-over point is fixed and not adjustable for the most part.
Basically, an active cross-over allows you to change the cross-over point(s) across a set frequency band where as a passive, the cross-over point is fixed and not adjustable for the most part.
08-27-2004, 06:49 AM
#4
Originally posted by defro13:
the easiest thing to do would be to get a audio control 24xs, 24db/octave, get or make a 50hz x-over chip for it, change the subsonic chip to 20hz from the factory 33hz. i have sold a few cyclones over the years and still have the ported(dukk will lke it ) design saved. if you need some help with a box, i could email you the box parameters, but i will warn you now, its BIG, that baby need a big box, almost 4 cubic ft. do you know what generation cyclone you got, what do the vanes, the paddle looking things look like they are made of, this is a good indicator of what generation yo have
the easiest thing to do would be to get a audio control 24xs, 24db/octave, get or make a 50hz x-over chip for it, change the subsonic chip to 20hz from the factory 33hz. i have sold a few cyclones over the years and still have the ported(dukk will lke it
) design saved. if you need some help with a box, i could email you the box parameters, but i will warn you now, its BIG, that baby need a big box, almost 4 cubic ft. do you know what generation cyclone you got, what do the vanes, the paddle looking things look like they are made of, this is a good indicator of what generation yo have
Wow... there's nothing easier?
I've seen that they need about a 2.0-2.5cf sealed box. That's probably what I'll go with for now.
If I feel adventurous I may hit you up for that ported design. Thanks for the offer though
08-27-2004, 07:20 AM
#5
Ok.. I've done some more searching.
I'm just wondering why I'd go with the AC 24XS instead of something less expensive.. like...
The Coustic XM2 which has a 18db high-pass slope, and a 36db low-pass (36 is better than 24, right?)
Or why I wouldn't go with the Interfire IF3X from GCA. (I like buying from Jon & Martine if I can) link
I'm just wondering why I'd go with the AC 24XS instead of something less expensive.. like...
The Coustic XM2 which has a 18db high-pass slope, and a 36db low-pass (36 is better than 24, right?)
Or why I wouldn't go with the Interfire IF3X from GCA. (I like buying from Jon & Martine if I can) link
08-27-2004, 07:41 AM
#6
Guest
Posts: n/a
the higher the x-over slope with the cyclone the better, the chips you can get premade froma ac dealer. i recommend the ac piece because ive used it many times, and its very good. the cyclone sealed is a far cry from it vented, when we originally got the cyclones we tried them sealed and the performance was poor, the guy that designed them, his name is dominic, i believe he works for mark levinson now, recommended vented, and if you cant belive the guy who designed and built them, who can you believe. im sure the other x-over you mentioned will be fine, i suggested the ac piece because ive used it with the cyclone on 2 occasions before and know it worked well, btw you can get used 24xs all over the place for under 100$, oh and the s.w.a.t. adjustmnent on the 24xs is very usefull in trying to tune the cyclone to the car
08-27-2004, 07:49 AM
#7
2000 Watt CAFz'r
Join Date: May 2003
Posts: 2,819
Notice Jordy how noone seems to wnat to the nittygritty as to what the differnce between passive and active is.....
I would like to know myself...
Could someone please answer that?
And thanks in advance...something thats puzzled me for a sometime now..
[ August 27, 2004, 08:50 AM: Message edited by: Team8Track ]
I would like to know myself...
Could someone please answer that?
And thanks in advance...something thats puzzled me for a sometime now..
[ August 27, 2004, 08:50 AM: Message edited by: Team8Track ]
08-27-2004, 08:07 AM
#8
Originally posted by Team8Track:
Notice Jordy how noone seems to wnat to the nittygritty as to what the differnce between passive and active is.....
I would like to know myself...
Notice Jordy how noone seems to wnat to the nittygritty as to what the differnce between passive and active is.....
I would like to know myself...
08-27-2004, 08:42 AM
#9
Guest
Posts: n/a
passive x-overs filter out frequncies in the hi level domain, aka, after the amplifier the with the use use of capacitor(s),coil(s) and sometimes resistors, the use of 1 coil or cap is 6db/octave, the use of a cap and a coil 12db/octave, the use of 2 coils and a cap is 18db/octave, the use of 2 coils and 2 caps is 24db/octave. resistors can be used to lower the output of any given speaker in a passive network, these are basic descriptions of a passive, a electronic x-over is typically used in the low level domain, aka rca level. the most common types you see and adjusted with chips or potentiomemters(dials). they work on a similar premise like passive, the more resistors used of varying values the higher the x-over slope as well as frequncy changes, the preference is personal, some like electronic some like passive, its all up to you. keep in mind there is far more to to crossover than what ive mentioned, particularily in passive but that is the basic idea.
08-27-2004, 08:45 AM
#10
50 Watt CAFz'r
Join Date: May 2004
Posts: 189
Jordy0, dawgsbreakfast gave you one difference in that actives can be changed where passives are static. Here are a couple more differences:
- actives are pre amplifier while passives are post amplifier
- actives are electronic consisting of transistors and ic's while passives use caps, coils, resistors
There are more but alot of it comes down to electrical and electronics so I wont go into depth
Hope that helps
- actives are pre amplifier while passives are post amplifier
- actives are electronic consisting of transistors and ic's while passives use caps, coils, resistors
There are more but alot of it comes down to electrical and electronics so I wont go into depth
Hope that helps
