Tuning (long)
10-13-2004, 07:15 AM
#21
Guest
Posts: n/a
this is a question with lots of answers that cant be answered quickly, but some basic guidelines would be to keep your pathlegnths between your midbass/midrange, and tweeters as close as possible and as high up in your car as you can you can. experiment with many different mounting locations and decide which one sounds the best and is the most practical for you. but before you do that like dwvw said, you must have a decent reference, if you dont know how something is supposed to sound, how can you recreate it
10-13-2004, 10:32 AM
#22
Great info Dereck.
While on the subject of tuning, why not go into the details of Parametric EQ's vs Graphic eq's and the Pathlength theory? It would be good knowledge for most people even I wouldn't mind hearing different peole's oppinions on the subjects.
While on the subject of tuning, why not go into the details of Parametric EQ's vs Graphic eq's and the Pathlength theory? It would be good knowledge for most people even I wouldn't mind hearing different peole's oppinions on the subjects.
10-13-2004, 10:49 AM
#23
Originally posted by MegaHurtz:
One question I have is what about stuff like imaging/staging and fancy terms of the sort? From what I have gathered I want the sound to appear as it is coming from very far in front of me, high up and as wide as possible. How about some tips that I could go about achieve that kind of effect in my car?
One question I have is what about stuff like imaging/staging and fancy terms of the sort? From what I have gathered I want the sound to appear as it is coming from very far in front of me, high up and as wide as possible. How about some tips that I could go about achieve that kind of effect in my car?
10-13-2004, 02:16 PM
#24
I can't entirely agree with what Brandon said, as that would make the car sound good imaging and soundstage-wise only from 1 seat (drivers seat). Generally speaking, most people in the North American, left-hand drive market want to create a balanced sound from both seats. Meaning, that singer who is at center stage should sound like they are near your rearview mirror, regardless of if you sitting in the passenger or drivers seat. What the whole kick panel technique and pathlength discussion revolves around is trying to get the sound to arrive at your ears at the same time and amplitude, in both seats of the car. Kick panels help make that easier because if you measure it out, the pathlength from each kick panel to say the middle of your forehead in one of your seats can be within 12". Rule of thumb is to shoot for less than a 12" difference in path length for a balanced stage.
10-13-2004, 09:23 PM
#25
Sux is right, what I had mentioned would image your seat and not neccesarily the seat next to you. However, I believe, outside of competition, very few people with a car audio system take the time to image for both seats, unless thier car is built by a shop, and even then, sometimes, it sounds great from one seat only.
I have many friends that have built their system or have had it built and they come to me and ask me why the driver's seat sounds great but when they sat in the passenger seat for a listen it sounds like crap. I always tell them that they did not spend enough time on pathlength positioning.
If someone is willing to go into the subject, there is more to getting good staging from both seats than just pathlengths, PL's are just one peice of the puzzle, just like anything else, there is not just one magic potion for good staging.
I have many friends that have built their system or have had it built and they come to me and ask me why the driver's seat sounds great but when they sat in the passenger seat for a listen it sounds like crap. I always tell them that they did not spend enough time on pathlength positioning.
If someone is willing to go into the subject, there is more to getting good staging from both seats than just pathlengths, PL's are just one peice of the puzzle, just like anything else, there is not just one magic potion for good staging.
10-14-2004, 03:05 AM
#26
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Posts: n/a
pathlegnths are one issue but another major obstacle is frequncy response and tonality. getting very similar frequency response and tonilty in both seats is very difficult and this is what i belive most people hear as the main difference between drivers and passenger seats. if say, for instance, you have your speakers in the doors, floors, dash, whatever, the pathlegnths should be identical from both seats, but because most vehicles dont have the same shapse dash on both sides, the frequncy response and tonality will be radically differrent from both seats, even with less than 12" of pathlegnth differences. this is the problem i find in most cars that i listen to from both seats, there is usually significant sound differences from both seats. its very hard to get similar left and right channel frequncy response from both seats, this is the most major obstacle that i run into and where hours of tuning and compromise come in to play and where flexible eq's and x-overs are critical
10-15-2004, 10:24 PM
#27
Nice thread -- very informative Derek.
Using headphones is a favorite reference of mine too [img]graemlins/thumb.gif[/img] I got used to using them in the recording studio, although Hi Fi Headphones are VERY different from studio headphones.
Using headphones is a favorite reference of mine too [img]graemlins/thumb.gif[/img] I got used to using them in the recording studio, although Hi Fi Headphones are VERY different from studio headphones.
10-16-2004, 07:54 PM
#29
HI FI headphones (ie STAX, Sennheiser, AKG, Grado, etc) are "open" designs -- sound escapes the headphones -- designs like these have "depth".
Studio headphones are "closed" designs -- sound cannot escape -- this prevents the headphone's feed from "bleeding" onto the track you are recording
Both types of headphone are accurate and good sounding, but they do different jobs:
A Hi Fi headphone is like a home speaker -- you want to "enjoy" listening to it and you want a large "soundstage" and 3 dimensional image.
A studio headphone is like a studio monitor -- they are tools you use to hear what is "there" -- you especially want to hear mistakes and anything that may need "fixing".
Studio headphones are "closed" designs -- sound cannot escape -- this prevents the headphone's feed from "bleeding" onto the track you are recording
Both types of headphone are accurate and good sounding, but they do different jobs:
A Hi Fi headphone is like a home speaker -- you want to "enjoy" listening to it and you want a large "soundstage" and 3 dimensional image.
A studio headphone is like a studio monitor -- they are tools you use to hear what is "there" -- you especially want to hear mistakes and anything that may need "fixing".
