tweeter position - coaxial or A pillar?
11-01-2011, 04:03 PM
#1
tweeter position - coaxial or A pillar?
sorry - wrong area - if someone can move this post....I didn't see a delete option or I'd do it myself....but I don't want to double post.
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finally decided to get the Hertz HSK165 instead of the HCX165 but here's the install question
my existing speakers are an old set of 12 year old Focal 130K. The tweeter is custom mounted infront of the woofer in the door. reason for change is a rusted out crossover so connections cut in and out now.
I do not have Time Alignment on the deck
FYI - 2001 Jetta sedan
the install instructions for the Hertz have it recommending the A-pillar position and fire it to the opposite passenger on axis with the woofer.
the imaging is very good right now with the focal's tweeter in the lower door. should I follow the same position or go with Hertz's suggestion of A-pillar?
I'm not a DIY sort of guy. I just give it to the shop and let them do the work most of the time. Given that time is money, I'd like to choose the right position first and not have to run back and forth to the shop and listen to both positions and paying labour for both.
--------------
finally decided to get the Hertz HSK165 instead of the HCX165 but here's the install question
my existing speakers are an old set of 12 year old Focal 130K. The tweeter is custom mounted infront of the woofer in the door. reason for change is a rusted out crossover so connections cut in and out now.
I do not have Time Alignment on the deck
FYI - 2001 Jetta sedan
the install instructions for the Hertz have it recommending the A-pillar position and fire it to the opposite passenger on axis with the woofer.
the imaging is very good right now with the focal's tweeter in the lower door. should I follow the same position or go with Hertz's suggestion of A-pillar?
I'm not a DIY sort of guy. I just give it to the shop and let them do the work most of the time. Given that time is money, I'd like to choose the right position first and not have to run back and forth to the shop and listen to both positions and paying labour for both.
11-02-2011, 12:55 PM
#2
surprise surprise
going with the Audison AV X6.5 coaxials
keeping it simple for the install. but chatting with the distributor, they said if you get the Audison Comp or the Hertz Comp, to mount the tweeter high and not in the lower doors. They were designed that way.
Given that I don't have time alignment in the deck, then keep the install simple and get their coaxials instead. and the best one is their AV X6.5 and not the Hertz coaxials.
custom ordered though so I'll have to wait another week for the install.
going with the Audison AV X6.5 coaxials
keeping it simple for the install. but chatting with the distributor, they said if you get the Audison Comp or the Hertz Comp, to mount the tweeter high and not in the lower doors. They were designed that way.
Given that I don't have time alignment in the deck, then keep the install simple and get their coaxials instead. and the best one is their AV X6.5 and not the Hertz coaxials.
custom ordered though so I'll have to wait another week for the install.
11-23-2011, 09:36 AM
#4
what is the SS supplier?
what took an eternity, the speakers finally arrived at the shop and are getting installed this morning.
they let me look at my focal's coming out. the woofers are in great shape still so they'll be put aside for a future project.
the weight of one 5.25" focal mid driver equals the weight of both Audison x6.5.
hope I don't regret this move and end up with a set of Hertz MLK or Voce components. I always knew going from Focal's K series to a mid range brand speaker was a downgrade...but hopefully not too bad a downgrade.
given the amount of time (2-3 weeks) to get the Audison, there was talk of picking up a set of 28mm Hertz tweeters instead and reusing the Focal mid bass drivers.
well, we'll know at the end of the work day.
what took an eternity, the speakers finally arrived at the shop and are getting installed this morning.
they let me look at my focal's coming out. the woofers are in great shape still so they'll be put aside for a future project.
the weight of one 5.25" focal mid driver equals the weight of both Audison x6.5.
hope I don't regret this move and end up with a set of Hertz MLK or Voce components. I always knew going from Focal's K series to a mid range brand speaker was a downgrade...but hopefully not too bad a downgrade.
given the amount of time (2-3 weeks) to get the Audison, there was talk of picking up a set of 28mm Hertz tweeters instead and reusing the Focal mid bass drivers.
well, we'll know at the end of the work day.
11-24-2011, 10:17 AM
#5
well, it's time for some EQ tuning as the Audison's are a noticeable downgrade from the Focal's.
this was a bit of a surprise as I didn't touch anything on the 5 band parametric and the sound was brighter and that really sweet fullness in the mid section that I had from the Focal's is gone now.
I expected more from this speaker but I think I was guilty of reading the spec sheet. going from a 5.25 to a 6.25 woofer I figured I'd actually gain in the mid range...but some of the lost mid bass is probably from not changing the cross over point on the amp (yet).
I'm hoping that I can work some EQ magic and at least boost some of that mid range back.
other options is to go back to an idea I had and picking up a set of 28mm Hertz tweeters and new crossovers and using the Focal mid bass drivers which are in great shape still.
---
to keep with my opening post in this thread, the imaging is great in the door still so my decision for a coaxial set up is still the right one. Even if I end up with a component set, the coaxial set up is ideal in my car.
this was a bit of a surprise as I didn't touch anything on the 5 band parametric and the sound was brighter and that really sweet fullness in the mid section that I had from the Focal's is gone now.
I expected more from this speaker but I think I was guilty of reading the spec sheet. going from a 5.25 to a 6.25 woofer I figured I'd actually gain in the mid range...but some of the lost mid bass is probably from not changing the cross over point on the amp (yet).
I'm hoping that I can work some EQ magic and at least boost some of that mid range back.
other options is to go back to an idea I had and picking up a set of 28mm Hertz tweeters and new crossovers and using the Focal mid bass drivers which are in great shape still.
---
to keep with my opening post in this thread, the imaging is great in the door still so my decision for a coaxial set up is still the right one. Even if I end up with a component set, the coaxial set up is ideal in my car.
Last edited by gsdye; 11-24-2011 at 10:20 AM.
11-24-2011, 11:35 AM
#6
well, it's time for some EQ tuning as the Audison's are a noticeable downgrade from the Focal's.
this was a bit of a surprise as I didn't touch anything on the 5 band parametric and the sound was brighter and that really sweet fullness in the mid section that I had from the Focal's is gone now.
I expected more from this speaker but I think I was guilty of reading the spec sheet. going from a 5.25 to a 6.25 woofer I figured I'd actually gain in the mid range...but some of the lost mid bass is probably from not changing the cross over point on the amp (yet).
I'm hoping that I can work some EQ magic and at least boost some of that mid range back.
other options is to go back to an idea I had and picking up a set of 28mm Hertz tweeters and new crossovers and using the Focal mid bass drivers which are in great shape still.
---
to keep with my opening post in this thread, the imaging is great in the door still so my decision for a coaxial set up is still the right one. Even if I end up with a component set, the coaxial set up is ideal in my car.
this was a bit of a surprise as I didn't touch anything on the 5 band parametric and the sound was brighter and that really sweet fullness in the mid section that I had from the Focal's is gone now.
I expected more from this speaker but I think I was guilty of reading the spec sheet. going from a 5.25 to a 6.25 woofer I figured I'd actually gain in the mid range...but some of the lost mid bass is probably from not changing the cross over point on the amp (yet).
I'm hoping that I can work some EQ magic and at least boost some of that mid range back.
other options is to go back to an idea I had and picking up a set of 28mm Hertz tweeters and new crossovers and using the Focal mid bass drivers which are in great shape still.
---
to keep with my opening post in this thread, the imaging is great in the door still so my decision for a coaxial set up is still the right one. Even if I end up with a component set, the coaxial set up is ideal in my car.
11-25-2011, 12:45 PM
#9
tuning help
going to clean up the system now
turns out there's only one set of RCA's from the deck to the xtant P500 5 band parametric
so I cannot do any proper tuning from the deck. I run a tone bypass full signal to the EQ right now...which is a GOOD thing...but I might as well run a second set of RCA so the EQ can manage the front and the sub if I so choose....ideally you don't want to replicate tuning all over the place.
from the EQ to the AMP I have only one set of RCA's also. should I run a separate sub channel also?
on the amp there's another crossover...high pass and low pass.
given how much lower my new 6.25" audison (50Hz) front stage theoretically can go versus the 5.25" focal (90Hz), I think it's set at 120Hz right now (or maybe 90Hz - have to pull the sip to check). I might as well lower the cross over point for the front and sub. I just picked up a 70 and 80Hz SIP's for my Xtant amp.
one reason for the better mid bass on the Focal is that it's a 93dB sensitivity compared to 91dB for the Audison. That is a noticeable efficiency gain.
going to clean up the system now
turns out there's only one set of RCA's from the deck to the xtant P500 5 band parametric
so I cannot do any proper tuning from the deck. I run a tone bypass full signal to the EQ right now...which is a GOOD thing...but I might as well run a second set of RCA so the EQ can manage the front and the sub if I so choose....ideally you don't want to replicate tuning all over the place.
from the EQ to the AMP I have only one set of RCA's also. should I run a separate sub channel also?
on the amp there's another crossover...high pass and low pass.
given how much lower my new 6.25" audison (50Hz) front stage theoretically can go versus the 5.25" focal (90Hz), I think it's set at 120Hz right now (or maybe 90Hz - have to pull the sip to check). I might as well lower the cross over point for the front and sub. I just picked up a 70 and 80Hz SIP's for my Xtant amp.
one reason for the better mid bass on the Focal is that it's a 93dB sensitivity compared to 91dB for the Audison. That is a noticeable efficiency gain.
11-28-2011, 09:49 PM
#10
downloaded a RTA/pink noise generator app on my iPhone and did some basic EQ tuning off the deck as a quick 5 minute job.
helped a lot..the highs are not as harsh and the mid bass is tighter. Switching to bypass mode shows the difference
but I've lost some "air" to the soundstage. there are a lot of drop offs too still
going to go back to tone bypass on the deck and start on the 5 band parametric Xtant this week when I have an hour
helped a lot..the highs are not as harsh and the mid bass is tighter. Switching to bypass mode shows the difference
but I've lost some "air" to the soundstage. there are a lot of drop offs too still
going to go back to tone bypass on the deck and start on the 5 band parametric Xtant this week when I have an hour
Last edited by gsdye; 11-28-2011 at 09:51 PM.
