Baitcar dot com
06-17-2005, 12:25 PM
#12
50 Watt CAFz'r
Join Date: Dec 2001
Posts: 197
They used to leave the keys in the car, maybe they dont anymore because of the opposition to their tactics.
Entrapment
1. To catch in or as if in a trap.
2.
a. To lure into danger, difficulty, or a compromising situation.
b. To lure into performing a previously or otherwise uncontemplated illegal act.
1, the person is being caught in a trap. 2, they are in a way being lured into the act, again it's like putting a pile of money on the ground. People who wouldnt rob the bank will still pick up the money.
I know the we all think it's great to catch criminals no matter what it takes, i just think that when they bend the law in order to enforce the law, what's going to be next. Just wait until someone has their car impounded for playing their music too loud. Im sure every cca member will be screaming bloody murder, but the other 90% of the population will be laughing at you guys and praising the cops for getting rid of those 'damn punks and their loud stereos'.
Entrapment
1. To catch in or as if in a trap.
2.
a. To lure into danger, difficulty, or a compromising situation.
b. To lure into performing a previously or otherwise uncontemplated illegal act.
1, the person is being caught in a trap. 2, they are in a way being lured into the act, again it's like putting a pile of money on the ground. People who wouldnt rob the bank will still pick up the money.
I know the we all think it's great to catch criminals no matter what it takes, i just think that when they bend the law in order to enforce the law, what's going to be next. Just wait until someone has their car impounded for playing their music too loud. Im sure every cca member will be screaming bloody murder, but the other 90% of the population will be laughing at you guys and praising the cops for getting rid of those 'damn punks and their loud stereos'.
06-17-2005, 01:12 PM
#13
1000 Watt CAFz'r
Join Date: Jun 2002
Posts: 1,242
^^Nobody is telling the car theives to steal the car.
No one says, psst come here and steal this car.
All the cops are doing is placing a car in an area that has high theft probability and waiting to see what happens.
Is it really illegal to pick up money off the gound and keep it?
No one says, psst come here and steal this car.
All the cops are doing is placing a car in an area that has high theft probability and waiting to see what happens.
Is it really illegal to pick up money off the gound and keep it?
06-17-2005, 01:26 PM
#14
^^^Exactly Money is impossible to "own", and you can't register it in your name. The only way you can prove ownership is to record the serial numbers, and that is circumstancial evidence at best. A car has to be registered in your name. The pile of money simile does not work. On the other hand, if you picked up a $30,000 necklace with the owners name and address engraved on it, I'm sure that you would not pick it up and keep it, you would try to find the owner if you were an honest law abiding person. Even that is a bad comparison. An unlocked car is not just there sitting on the ground. Again do you pay enough attention to parked cars and notice that the keys are in it and it's unlocked? Generally only someone who is looking to steal a car notices things like that.
06-17-2005, 09:10 PM
#16
50 Watt CAFz'r
Join Date: Dec 2001
Posts: 197
Ah, so it's different if it's money instead of a car? You wouldnt just leave the pile of money there until the owner comes back for it? What if the cops set the stack of money there and setup a camera and arrested anyone that picked up the money? Is the situation different now?
I guess both viewpoints are hard to argue. Perhaps because it's more a matter of ethics than laws. So is setting up the baitcar trap ethical? Or is it a substitute for a good investigation into a crime. Maybe the cops are just tired of not being able to catch the thieves the old fashioned way.
I guess both viewpoints are hard to argue. Perhaps because it's more a matter of ethics than laws. So is setting up the baitcar trap ethical? Or is it a substitute for a good investigation into a crime. Maybe the cops are just tired of not being able to catch the thieves the old fashioned way.
06-18-2005, 02:43 PM
#17
^ Well regardless it's not entrapement. The legal definition is different than the actual definition of the word [img]tongue.gif[/img]
Anywayto steal the car someone has to break into it. Thats a crime in itself. If theres money on the ground, how is that stealing anything?
Now if the money was in the car, and you broke into it and took the money...that's a crime.
ENTRAPMENT - A person is 'entrapped' when he is induced or persuaded by law enforcement officers or their agents to commit a crime that he had no previous intent to commit; and the law as a matter of policy forbids conviction in such a case.
However, there is no entrapment where a person is ready and willing to break the law and the Government agents merely provide what appears to be a favorable opportunity for the person to commit the crime. For example, it is not entrapment for a Government agent to pretend to be someone else and to offer, either directly or through an informer or other decoy, to engage in an unlawful transaction with the person. So, a person would not be a victim of entrapment if the person was ready, willing and able to commit the crime charged in the indictment whenever opportunity was afforded, and that Government officers or their agents did no more than offer an opportunity.
Anywayto steal the car someone has to break into it. Thats a crime in itself. If theres money on the ground, how is that stealing anything?
Now if the money was in the car, and you broke into it and took the money...that's a crime.
ENTRAPMENT - A person is 'entrapped' when he is induced or persuaded by law enforcement officers or their agents to commit a crime that he had no previous intent to commit; and the law as a matter of policy forbids conviction in such a case.
However, there is no entrapment where a person is ready and willing to break the law and the Government agents merely provide what appears to be a favorable opportunity for the person to commit the crime. For example, it is not entrapment for a Government agent to pretend to be someone else and to offer, either directly or through an informer or other decoy, to engage in an unlawful transaction with the person. So, a person would not be a victim of entrapment if the person was ready, willing and able to commit the crime charged in the indictment whenever opportunity was afforded, and that Government officers or their agents did no more than offer an opportunity.
06-23-2005, 02:41 PM
#19
50 Watt CAFz'r
Join Date: May 2004
Posts: 161
I like the bait car idea, not only is it good for catching thieves, but if advertised, it's a very good deterrent. If they know that there's a chance of a car being a bait car, they might think twice about it. Allthough, myself not being a criminal, I can't say if that's the right thought process of a thief, but it's just my 2 cents.
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