another reason why sanctioning is a waste of time and money
02-25-2009, 09:36 AM
#22
50 Watt CAFz'r
Join Date: Nov 2002
Posts: 429
sawnicxs
Since 1993 there have been many upgrades...LOL! PM me your name and I can see if you are still on file, but you will need to attend a upcoming training to recertify as you are way overdue. PLUS WHEN U PAY TO ATTEND A TRAINING YOU ALSO GET A ONE YEAR MEMBERSHIP, NEW RULE BOOK AND CD. I not sure where you are from but there will be one in ONTARIO, I am NOW in talks with someone about having one in QUEBEC, and I still hope to get one happening out WEST.
Since 1993 there have been many upgrades...LOL! PM me your name and I can see if you are still on file, but you will need to attend a upcoming training to recertify as you are way overdue. PLUS WHEN U PAY TO ATTEND A TRAINING YOU ALSO GET A ONE YEAR MEMBERSHIP, NEW RULE BOOK AND CD. I not sure where you are from but there will be one in ONTARIO, I am NOW in talks with someone about having one in QUEBEC, and I still hope to get one happening out WEST.
02-25-2009, 11:46 AM
#23
Guest
Posts: n/a
Your perceptions of IASCA are duely noted and I take everyones comments very seriously, but what I will not stand for is people who state we are just IRRATANT. I take my business very seriously and I have put more hours in for free then anyone will ever know simply to try and give back to the industry that has helped me for so many years.
I have said this before and I will say it again, I am more then willing to have a conversation with you or anyone else who would like to set up a judges training. I will discuss with them the cost involved and how to budget the event.
AND as for the sanctioning fees. Single point events cost a measly $25.00.
02-25-2009, 12:34 PM
#24
I hate this subject if only because it makes me agree with Dave 
IASCA has really screwed the pooch in Canada lately.
Making SBN their finals was the final nail in the coffin for me. Actually, let me correct myself, making it at NOPI was the final nail. Bringing it to SBN at the WRONG time of year just makes it worse for so many different reasons. Allow me to list them :P
1 - My car is still in storage when SBN happens - just like a lot of other Canadian competitors. Dragging it out to make the 24hr drive to Daytona is ridiculous
2 - No one wants their first show of the year to be a FINALS.
3 - No one will want to drag their car out of storage in Feb/Mar while it's still freezing cold out to try and work on their system. So you will almost certainly compete with whatever your system was at the time it was stored.
4 - One of the largest competitor bases for IASCA was in Northern NY and Ontario. By putting it down in Florida you've essentially walked away from all of us. Clearly a slap in the face.
5 - The rules have gotten stupid. I understand that IASCA doesn't want to match other orgs 100% because they want to do their own thing.. but going SO far away from what the rest of them do is insane. Being the only org that limits runs of wire means that people either build for IASCA and only IASCA or they get bumped to classes much higher than they should be in. The idea should be to include as many people as possible, not exclude them!
I'm sure I could go on for hours and this is only the SPL portion. I'm sure Dave has a list of reasons why the SQ portion is BS too.
Jason - I think you're a nice guy but I WOULD say this all to you in person. I just don't believe it's worth the trouble. They've never listened to us in the past so why would they start now?
IASCA has really screwed the pooch in Canada lately.
Making SBN their finals was the final nail in the coffin for me. Actually, let me correct myself, making it at NOPI was the final nail. Bringing it to SBN at the WRONG time of year just makes it worse for so many different reasons. Allow me to list them :P
1 - My car is still in storage when SBN happens - just like a lot of other Canadian competitors. Dragging it out to make the 24hr drive to Daytona is ridiculous
2 - No one wants their first show of the year to be a FINALS.
3 - No one will want to drag their car out of storage in Feb/Mar while it's still freezing cold out to try and work on their system. So you will almost certainly compete with whatever your system was at the time it was stored.
4 - One of the largest competitor bases for IASCA was in Northern NY and Ontario. By putting it down in Florida you've essentially walked away from all of us. Clearly a slap in the face.
5 - The rules have gotten stupid. I understand that IASCA doesn't want to match other orgs 100% because they want to do their own thing.. but going SO far away from what the rest of them do is insane. Being the only org that limits runs of wire means that people either build for IASCA and only IASCA or they get bumped to classes much higher than they should be in. The idea should be to include as many people as possible, not exclude them!
I'm sure I could go on for hours and this is only the SPL portion. I'm sure Dave has a list of reasons why the SQ portion is BS too.
Jason - I think you're a nice guy but I WOULD say this all to you in person. I just don't believe it's worth the trouble. They've never listened to us in the past so why would they start now?
02-25-2009, 01:34 PM
#25
Guest
Posts: n/a
i actually heard a certified iasca sq judge say to competitor last year......"your car had great midbass, but i just didnt like it".....it was one of the funniest things ive ever heard a judge say...........it would appear that perhaps iasca should have a refresher course for the existing pool of certified judges they have out west before trying to train new ones.......oh yes and this is worth mentioning......it was the western finals that that interesting comment was made.......that comment was one of the reason why i wanted to become a judge......becuase it was apparent they needed help......we all just had a laugh remembering that comment.....as disturbing as it was...it was funny....almost as funny as the guy on this site that said jbl tweeters have good impact....that was another nugget that i will never forget.....anyways....i will post the daves sq and install sheets for you all to have a look at
02-25-2009, 02:11 PM
#26
50 Watt CAFz'r
Join Date: Nov 2002
Posts: 429
JORDY.
Thanks for the input! Thnks for saying I am a nice guy. Appreciate that
No org is perfect, NOBODY and sure IASCA has its fair share of problems, but I am not going to give in with out a fight. Its one reason I decided to focus on bigger shows rather then have tons of little shows. Also one thing that is very obvious is IDBL is the least popular of the orgs up here, and I have no certain way how to fix that but I do know that I have a very big meeting to attend at SBN and I have many things I need to address. Guys who compete in SPL have three very good orgs from which to play and I think thats great as it gives them a chance to try different orgs as well as gives them lots of opportunitites to compete. To me its all about having a place to compete and have fun.
BUT FOR SQ those guys are limited to the orgs that do SQ and because I am so passionate about SQ I will do what ever I can to make sure they have a place to compete.
I have competed, judged, or attended every different org out there all over the world and I will say that IASCA sets the bar when it comes to SQ rules. Is it going to please everyone, obviously not, and I realize that, its just a fact of life.
I am going to sum up some of your points with out writing ten pages of info.
1. This was not easy decision for myself or the people that make up the board at IASCA.
We talked about this for what seemed like forever and I even appraoched some of my own team as well as others about how they would feel about such a move. There were mixed feelings for sure but It was more yahs, then nahs. Some people like the fact that they no longer had to travel twice down south if they wanted to do both shows. Making one trip was more economical especially in todays economy.
Also a big factor in this decision was the companies who pay money to set up booths at these shows and all other orgs finals. Those companies are feeling the pinch and trust me I know what I am talking about when it comes to this topic. I talk to to CEO's from all over the U.S, Canada and ASIA and they are making the best out of this economical situation. So by joining two big shows into one helps the companies with there advertsing budgets. THEY WERE ALL FOR THIS!
2. The first show of the year is two shows in one. First show is FINALS. The next day is SBN.
Some people like this set up Jordy as it gives them all Winter to prep there cars to make them the best they can be for two big shows. I know when I competed there were times I wished I had more time to fix my car or add upgrades before Finals. I simply had no time.
Plus in the past IASCA has had Finals in various months at the end of the year. We had Finals in SEPT, OCT, and even NOV once and guess what....we had all kinds of pissed off competitors because those dates didnt work for them either. And thats my point Jordy is that no matter where or when IASCA had there Finals, NOT EVERYONE WAS HAPPY.
3. I to have a competition car that I only drive in the summer, so I know exactly where u are coming from here. All I can say is this. This years FINALS is not set in stone for all the following years, so lets see how it goes first. IASCA and myself will crunch the data and see if it was a success or not.
4.We do have a strong competitor base in those areas and I wish there was a way to have a finals closer to home but I just dont see it happening. Eastern, Southern Florida is also very strong as is the mid south so we have to consider all.
I for one would love to have a CDN FINALS with all the orgs but that is a topic for another day
5. I am no expert when it comes to the whole SPL thing and I am pretty sure everyone knows that. I do know there are some rule changes coming that will hopefully fix some of these issues with IDBL. All I can keep doing is taking everyones suggestions and talk them over with IASCA. Trust me they do listen, especially MOE!
THE SQ rules to me are fine just the way they are.
Not sure if this helps Jordy. I am glad for one thing about this post. I certainly am finding out some interesting facts. I am open to all suggestions.
Cheers
Thanks for the input! Thnks for saying I am a nice guy. Appreciate that
No org is perfect, NOBODY and sure IASCA has its fair share of problems, but I am not going to give in with out a fight. Its one reason I decided to focus on bigger shows rather then have tons of little shows. Also one thing that is very obvious is IDBL is the least popular of the orgs up here, and I have no certain way how to fix that but I do know that I have a very big meeting to attend at SBN and I have many things I need to address. Guys who compete in SPL have three very good orgs from which to play and I think thats great as it gives them a chance to try different orgs as well as gives them lots of opportunitites to compete. To me its all about having a place to compete and have fun.BUT FOR SQ those guys are limited to the orgs that do SQ and because I am so passionate about SQ I will do what ever I can to make sure they have a place to compete.
I have competed, judged, or attended every different org out there all over the world and I will say that IASCA sets the bar when it comes to SQ rules. Is it going to please everyone, obviously not, and I realize that, its just a fact of life.
I am going to sum up some of your points with out writing ten pages of info.
1. This was not easy decision for myself or the people that make up the board at IASCA.
We talked about this for what seemed like forever and I even appraoched some of my own team as well as others about how they would feel about such a move. There were mixed feelings for sure but It was more yahs, then nahs. Some people like the fact that they no longer had to travel twice down south if they wanted to do both shows. Making one trip was more economical especially in todays economy.
Also a big factor in this decision was the companies who pay money to set up booths at these shows and all other orgs finals. Those companies are feeling the pinch and trust me I know what I am talking about when it comes to this topic. I talk to to CEO's from all over the U.S, Canada and ASIA and they are making the best out of this economical situation. So by joining two big shows into one helps the companies with there advertsing budgets. THEY WERE ALL FOR THIS!
2. The first show of the year is two shows in one. First show is FINALS. The next day is SBN.
Some people like this set up Jordy as it gives them all Winter to prep there cars to make them the best they can be for two big shows. I know when I competed there were times I wished I had more time to fix my car or add upgrades before Finals. I simply had no time.
Plus in the past IASCA has had Finals in various months at the end of the year. We had Finals in SEPT, OCT, and even NOV once and guess what....we had all kinds of pissed off competitors because those dates didnt work for them either. And thats my point Jordy is that no matter where or when IASCA had there Finals, NOT EVERYONE WAS HAPPY.
3. I to have a competition car that I only drive in the summer, so I know exactly where u are coming from here. All I can say is this. This years FINALS is not set in stone for all the following years, so lets see how it goes first. IASCA and myself will crunch the data and see if it was a success or not.
4.We do have a strong competitor base in those areas and I wish there was a way to have a finals closer to home but I just dont see it happening. Eastern, Southern Florida is also very strong as is the mid south so we have to consider all.
I for one would love to have a CDN FINALS with all the orgs but that is a topic for another day
5. I am no expert when it comes to the whole SPL thing and I am pretty sure everyone knows that. I do know there are some rule changes coming that will hopefully fix some of these issues with IDBL. All I can keep doing is taking everyones suggestions and talk them over with IASCA. Trust me they do listen, especially MOE!
THE SQ rules to me are fine just the way they are.
Not sure if this helps Jordy. I am glad for one thing about this post. I certainly am finding out some interesting facts. I am open to all suggestions.
Cheers
02-25-2009, 02:27 PM
#27
50 Watt CAFz'r
Join Date: Nov 2002
Posts: 429
DEFRO.
I am only going to say this one more time.
If BC is going to hold IASCA shows they will need more judges then just you. Others who obviously a expert in the field of 12v will need some training.
ALSO nobody will have to go to SBN or Ontario to become a judge. I am more then Willing to come out there and host a training but I need to go over with someone who wants to help with the training how that works. I need a promoter out there who wants to tackle this with me.
The refreshers course is the same as the regular training. So new and old judges can all come.
Also considering IASCA has not had a training out there in some time I would love to know who is judging these shows.
I am 100% certain after reading your comments that the time has come where I need to recertify SOME of these judges.
DEFRO, if you are the SQ expert that you claim to be then you for one will understand my next answer. Not everyone who thinks they can judge can actully judge. SQ is not easy to do as it takes lots of experience to judge a car properly.. That is why I have a tracking system that tell me what kind of shows each one of my own judges can do. I have many judges here in Ontario and only some are certified/qualified to judge 3X events or Finals. Mu judges have to do judge so many shows before they move up the ladder. This keeps the quality of the shows I hold very high as I try to give my competitors the best judges I can.
And this all starts with training and starting a judges matrix(experience chart) with all the judges out there.
I am going to some investigating with Moe and see whats been taking place out WEST.
PS AS much as you like BEER there is no alcohol allowed during training But we could cetainly have one after.
I am only going to say this one more time.
If BC is going to hold IASCA shows they will need more judges then just you. Others who obviously a expert in the field of 12v will need some training.
ALSO nobody will have to go to SBN or Ontario to become a judge. I am more then Willing to come out there and host a training but I need to go over with someone who wants to help with the training how that works. I need a promoter out there who wants to tackle this with me.
The refreshers course is the same as the regular training. So new and old judges can all come.
Also considering IASCA has not had a training out there in some time I would love to know who is judging these shows.
I am 100% certain after reading your comments that the time has come where I need to recertify SOME of these judges.
DEFRO, if you are the SQ expert that you claim to be then you for one will understand my next answer. Not everyone who thinks they can judge can actully judge. SQ is not easy to do as it takes lots of experience to judge a car properly.. That is why I have a tracking system that tell me what kind of shows each one of my own judges can do. I have many judges here in Ontario and only some are certified/qualified to judge 3X events or Finals. Mu judges have to do judge so many shows before they move up the ladder. This keeps the quality of the shows I hold very high as I try to give my competitors the best judges I can.
And this all starts with training and starting a judges matrix(experience chart) with all the judges out there.
I am going to some investigating with Moe and see whats been taking place out WEST.
PS AS much as you like BEER there is no alcohol allowed during training
But we could cetainly have one after.
02-25-2009, 02:34 PM
#28
Guest
Posts: n/a
for the record....i think idbl is a better format for spl for the average competitor.....i think their sq scoresheet and disc embrasses usaci's.....i like the iasca format better than the other organizations for sure....its the pia about it that bugs me....it should be easy to do this stuff....not complicated and costly.....having said that...can i sanction my shows for 25 bucks each and get a honorary judges certificate or complete an online test or something simple and easy(were not creating doctors here)so i can judge the cars at ours and other show and add at least 6 iasca shows to your western schedule.....like i said, i have the rule book, the cds and another fella that works for us is certified to do the spl part already.....and i never said i was an sq expert...i said i have alot of experience judging and am trying to work with iasca to grow the sport out west and i think its waste of your time and money to come all the way out west to hold a judges training.....and if i cant have a beer at training.....i aint coming...thats another dumb rule
Last edited by defro13; 02-25-2009 at 02:40 PM.
02-25-2009, 02:43 PM
#29
50 Watt CAFz'r
Join Date: Nov 2002
Posts: 429
Defro
I need your full name & Give me a day to talk to Moe. Then please call me so we can figure this out. I know were in different time zones but I am easy to get ahold of.
905 436 7238
905 431 0282
You can PM your name and contact info if u wish.
I need your full name & Give me a day to talk to Moe. Then please call me so we can figure this out. I know were in different time zones but I am easy to get ahold of.
905 436 7238
905 431 0282
You can PM your name and contact info if u wish.
02-25-2009, 05:18 PM
#30
Goalie Man
Join Date: May 2003
Posts: 1,412
ok ok enough yelling.... damn i have a headach already......... how about this dave/jason... i dont want to drive/fly/bus/taxi to ontario or sbn, but i feel iasca should certify me... so what do we do..... how about if we get 15 or more people that want to be certified. we all know nothing is free so iasca charges us, oh say $150 bucks, and for that we get, one yr. membership, one rules book, two c.d,s one sq one spl. and we get trained. training should only be one day.. sat starting at 8am till noon then 130pm till 8pm. done!! now iasca needs a place to hold this event so someone like trends or another shop offer there space to hold the show, i think thats it. now dave, randy, james, robert, dukk, pato, jeff, pat, mike, rob m, ect get certified for dirt cheap, and shows can be held for a paltry $25bucks a show.... thats what i would like to see... what do you think.
