The Cable Test
Originally posted by PEI330Ci:
Yes I have pics, it is possible that there will be NO difference, and I can't prove to anyone. It's all subjective folks...
Yes I have pics, it is possible that there will be NO difference, and I can't prove to anyone. It's all subjective folks...
X
Thread Starter
1000 Watt CAFz'r
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 1,783
I've just spent 6 hours wiring in over 30 banana pin connectors to all the speaker cables in the test, as well as my passive X.O.s. Still more work to do...have to get the head unit RCAs assessable....and lay all this stuff into the car.
Did I mention I'm doing this in my driveway and we've got freezing rain all day. Great fun.
Adam
Did I mention I'm doing this in my driveway and we've got freezing rain all day. Great fun.
Adam
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Posts: n/a
I think it will be interesting to see what sort of results come out of this. When your dealing with cable the differences will be so small, you would pretty much have to have a RTA to track the data. Even going from the worst to the best cables out there, I would find it difficult to "hear" an actuall difference.
The one advantage you have is your dealing with the exact same environment and equipment. Unlike judging SQ cars, you establish a base and then score the other cars from that. I find it would be hard to establish that base to go from.
I would be more interested in some actuall RTA results in the end. But test away! IT should make for some good conversation!
The one advantage you have is your dealing with the exact same environment and equipment. Unlike judging SQ cars, you establish a base and then score the other cars from that. I find it would be hard to establish that base to go from.
I would be more interested in some actuall RTA results in the end. But test away! IT should make for some good conversation!
Thread Starter
1000 Watt CAFz'r
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 1,783
Correction....I have an RTA avialable! My dad only took one of his RTAs with him.(he's a proffesional speaker designer) I'll be doing RTA work soon.
However, from past experience, cable changes don't show up on an RTA. And I've got access to really high precision RTAs (256 points per octave) Unless you've got some really crappy cable [img]smile.gif[/img]
I'm still working here guys...be patient...I've wired up the system for a whole whack of tests other than what I've listed above. It's easier for me to do all the work now, although it's taking me forever...
Adam
However, from past experience, cable changes don't show up on an RTA. And I've got access to really high precision RTAs (256 points per octave) Unless you've got some really crappy cable [img]smile.gif[/img]
I'm still working here guys...be patient...I've wired up the system for a whole whack of tests other than what I've listed above. It's easier for me to do all the work now, although it's taking me forever...
Adam
Thread Starter
1000 Watt CAFz'r
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 1,783
HOLY CRAP!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
I just started playing with the interconnect, and it's amazing!!!!
The Monster Cable XLN Pro images horribly. I thought it was my install.
Then I tried the Kimber pure silver interconnect, and the imaging improved imencely. I couldn't believe how much of a difference it made.
Then I switched to the Purist Audio Design Colosus interconnect. This was much more balanced tonally, but it didn't image as well. Then I switched back to the XLN Pro...and the image colapsed...I mean it disappeared.
I'm litteraly jumping up and down here...the Kimber cable has made a huge difference.
I'm going back to the car, more listening to do.
boy this stuff is fun
Adam
I just started playing with the interconnect, and it's amazing!!!!
The Monster Cable XLN Pro images horribly. I thought it was my install.
Then I tried the Kimber pure silver interconnect, and the imaging improved imencely. I couldn't believe how much of a difference it made.
Then I switched to the Purist Audio Design Colosus interconnect. This was much more balanced tonally, but it didn't image as well. Then I switched back to the XLN Pro...and the image colapsed...I mean it disappeared.
I'm litteraly jumping up and down here...the Kimber cable has made a huge difference.
I'm going back to the car, more listening to do.
boy this stuff is fun
Adam
50 Watt CAFz'r
Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 192
Hey
Nice to see you're trying the Purist stuff, it is very nice. I found much the same results when testing the long run from the HU to eq. I compared AQ's Emerald and Opals, TMC yellows, Alpha core Goetrz Micro Purl and Kimber Hero's. I preferred the AQ Emeralds the best but got a much better deal (chance) on a set of 4m Purist Colossus on ebay than the Emeralds.
The length of the cables also had an effect on the staging, the Kimber and Alpha core sounded deeper in shorter lengths than the long run.
I have also found in addition to imaging the detail varied with the different cables, specifically things like fingers sliding on the strings of a violin or guitar, sound of air passing over the mouth piece of a flute.
The cables need to be broken in for some period of time, I use a signal generator for 24 hours at 35Hz. I can't understand why this is but it does make a difference to me.
My dos centos J
Nice to see you're trying the Purist stuff, it is very nice. I found much the same results when testing the long run from the HU to eq. I compared AQ's Emerald and Opals, TMC yellows, Alpha core Goetrz Micro Purl and Kimber Hero's. I preferred the AQ Emeralds the best but got a much better deal (chance) on a set of 4m Purist Colossus on ebay than the Emeralds.
The length of the cables also had an effect on the staging, the Kimber and Alpha core sounded deeper in shorter lengths than the long run.
I have also found in addition to imaging the detail varied with the different cables, specifically things like fingers sliding on the strings of a violin or guitar, sound of air passing over the mouth piece of a flute.
The cables need to be broken in for some period of time, I use a signal generator for 24 hours at 35Hz. I can't understand why this is but it does make a difference to me.
My dos centos J
Thread Starter
1000 Watt CAFz'r
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 1,783
Ok, I've calmed down a bit.
But my opinion of the interconnect hasn't changed. The Kimber Silver has impressed me so much, that I'm going to talk to my Dad about a cable loan. This stuff has breathed life into my system.
Side Note: All of my listening was performed with my car engine and all other electronics off. My entire audio system is hard wired into my batteries.
Once again to recap, I've run a full range signal to the 4" Utopia mids mounted in the kick area. The angle of the drivers has been optimized to balance the sound evenly from both seats. I've balanced the left and right levels to be equal, and dialed 0.7 ms of delay into the left channel. This centers vocals very well. While my XLN Pro interconnect did image, I had to try to hear it. It took some effort for me to pick out instrument locations and sometimes even vocals.
Switching to the Kimber cable interconnect from the head unit to the amp made the system image effortlessly. I didn't have to make any effort to pick out intruments and even room sizes. Listening to Sara K, I could easily sense the room size.
The PAD cables were definitely better than the XLN Pro, but tonally didn't match my amplifier/speaker combo as well as the Kimber cable. Another issue was that the Colosus interconnect has huge terminations. I had to remove my amplifier's endplate to make the Colosus firmly seat. These cables in general have a warm character.
After playing around for a bit with the interconect, I moved on to the speaker cable. I used the Kimber silver interconect to see if the speaker cable could improve my imaging any more.
First I tried the PAD Colosus speaker cable. This cable is monsterous measuring 2" thick for each conductor, you won't fit this under your carpet. [img]smile.gif[/img] This cable actually sounds better than the Monster M10.2. It images a little bit better, but tonally everything is more life like. Music sounds effortless, and has a distinct warm signature. I really like this cable, but it doesn't offer the massive improvement in SQ that the Kimber interconnect did. The price of this speaker cable is very big, and of course so is it's size. For car audio, your money is better spend elsewhere.
The Kimber Silver speaker cable confused me. It has a strange sonic signature that didn't suite my system. It didn't just sound less life like than the PAD cable, it sounded like a totally different recording. I would rate it's imaging about the same as the Monster M10.2, but tonally it has some quirks. The quirks distracted me enough to make the imaging less convincing. Tonally this cable is a bit bright in the higher frequencies. It has a strong midrange that sounds detailed, but a bit too far foward. Vocals jump forward at you, a bit too much for my taste.
After sampling different combinations of all of the above, I arrived back at the Kimber interconnect and Monster M10.2 speaker cable. For me, with my system components, it offered the best tonal balance and brilliant imaging.
Next on the test schedule, introducing the DQX to the signal path for the front stage, and the ELF-1 processor to the subs.
I'll post that on a new thread.
Adam
But my opinion of the interconnect hasn't changed. The Kimber Silver has impressed me so much, that I'm going to talk to my Dad about a cable loan. This stuff has breathed life into my system.
Side Note: All of my listening was performed with my car engine and all other electronics off. My entire audio system is hard wired into my batteries.
Once again to recap, I've run a full range signal to the 4" Utopia mids mounted in the kick area. The angle of the drivers has been optimized to balance the sound evenly from both seats. I've balanced the left and right levels to be equal, and dialed 0.7 ms of delay into the left channel. This centers vocals very well. While my XLN Pro interconnect did image, I had to try to hear it. It took some effort for me to pick out instrument locations and sometimes even vocals.
Switching to the Kimber cable interconnect from the head unit to the amp made the system image effortlessly. I didn't have to make any effort to pick out intruments and even room sizes. Listening to Sara K, I could easily sense the room size.
The PAD cables were definitely better than the XLN Pro, but tonally didn't match my amplifier/speaker combo as well as the Kimber cable. Another issue was that the Colosus interconnect has huge terminations. I had to remove my amplifier's endplate to make the Colosus firmly seat. These cables in general have a warm character.
After playing around for a bit with the interconect, I moved on to the speaker cable. I used the Kimber silver interconect to see if the speaker cable could improve my imaging any more.
First I tried the PAD Colosus speaker cable. This cable is monsterous measuring 2" thick for each conductor, you won't fit this under your carpet. [img]smile.gif[/img] This cable actually sounds better than the Monster M10.2. It images a little bit better, but tonally everything is more life like. Music sounds effortless, and has a distinct warm signature. I really like this cable, but it doesn't offer the massive improvement in SQ that the Kimber interconnect did. The price of this speaker cable is very big, and of course so is it's size. For car audio, your money is better spend elsewhere.
The Kimber Silver speaker cable confused me. It has a strange sonic signature that didn't suite my system. It didn't just sound less life like than the PAD cable, it sounded like a totally different recording. I would rate it's imaging about the same as the Monster M10.2, but tonally it has some quirks. The quirks distracted me enough to make the imaging less convincing. Tonally this cable is a bit bright in the higher frequencies. It has a strong midrange that sounds detailed, but a bit too far foward. Vocals jump forward at you, a bit too much for my taste.
After sampling different combinations of all of the above, I arrived back at the Kimber interconnect and Monster M10.2 speaker cable. For me, with my system components, it offered the best tonal balance and brilliant imaging.
Next on the test schedule, introducing the DQX to the signal path for the front stage, and the ELF-1 processor to the subs.
I'll post that on a new thread.
Adam
Thread Starter
1000 Watt CAFz'r
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 1,783
Jaxom, I should have known better. Cables do make a difference, but I think you need to try before you buy to find what will work for your system. To be honest, I could change my amplifier and I might prefer different cables.
I'd like to encourage people to try out some high end cables from your deck to your amp. Maybe you'll hear a difference, maybe you won't. But if you do hear a difference, it won't always be better sounding. It's all up to experimentation...
Adam
I'd like to encourage people to try out some high end cables from your deck to your amp. Maybe you'll hear a difference, maybe you won't. But if you do hear a difference, it won't always be better sounding. It's all up to experimentation...
Adam
