A stupid n00b power qestion.
10-20-2003, 04:38 PM
#1
50 Watt CAFz'r
Thread Starter
Join Date: May 2003
Posts: 204
I am calling Cadence tomorrow to figure out how I can bridge my system properly and have it pound. It was hooked up for the entire sound system to run, not just the bass.
Stupid question. My subs are single 2ohm woofers. What would happen if I fed them 4 ohm? I can run my amp from stereo to 2 channels of mono 4 ohm.
Amp Manual (PDF): http://www.autosound.no/Cadence/PDF/Z-Amps.pdf
Sub Manual (PDF): http://www.autosound.no/Cadence/PDF/Z-WOOFERS.pdf
[ October 20, 2003, 05:50 PM: Message edited by: Fuzz ]
Stupid question. My subs are single 2ohm woofers. What would happen if I fed them 4 ohm? I can run my amp from stereo to 2 channels of mono 4 ohm.
Amp Manual (PDF): http://www.autosound.no/Cadence/PDF/Z-Amps.pdf
Sub Manual (PDF): http://www.autosound.no/Cadence/PDF/Z-WOOFERS.pdf
[ October 20, 2003, 05:50 PM: Message edited by: Fuzz ]
10-20-2003, 06:19 PM
#2
Kind of confused as to what you are asking. The 4000 is a 4 channel running your two subs and the rest of your system? The 4000 is rated at 150x4 at 2 ohms, run the two subs in stereo, third channel to one, 4th channel to the other, and I think you should be good to go. If you run the subs in series, then run it bridged off of the back half of the amp, I think it will produce the same power, someone correct me if I am wrong.....
[ October 20, 2003, 07:22 PM: Message edited by: JeepBeats ]
[ October 20, 2003, 07:22 PM: Message edited by: JeepBeats ]
10-20-2003, 08:26 PM
#3
50 Watt CAFz'r
Thread Starter
Join Date: May 2003
Posts: 204
Anp runs Mono @ 2x 300 @ 4ohm.
The anp used to run the rest of the system now it doesn't. My on buddies truck, it never did, it was always pure bass. He doesn't know how the amp was gooked up, I think the only person is the install, who I am going to go see tomorrow. I was just wondering if you knew that if I hooked up my subs to run 4ohm mono, even though they are 2 ohm subs, if there would be problems.
Meh, 20$ and I can re-tune it all.
The anp used to run the rest of the system now it doesn't. My on buddies truck, it never did, it was always pure bass. He doesn't know how the amp was gooked up, I think the only person is the install, who I am going to go see tomorrow. I was just wondering if you knew that if I hooked up my subs to run 4ohm mono, even though they are 2 ohm subs, if there would be problems.
Meh, 20$ and I can re-tune it all.
10-21-2003, 04:41 AM
#5
50 Watt CAFz'r
Thread Starter
Join Date: May 2003
Posts: 204
I tried that config a few months ago and I know it didn't work.
The amp is stable down to 2 ohms. It can actually run at 150 watt per channel @ 2ohm.
@ 4ohm = 4x75
@ 2ohm = 4x175
@ 4ohm MONO = 2x300
I thought the questions was pretty straight forward. If amp is sending 4 ohm power, to a 2 ohm driver, will there be problems?
The way I see it is that I am screwing a 60 watt lightbulb into a 100 watt lamp. The bulb will work, it will only be as bright as 60 watts can put to it.
I'm not that good with elecricity fundamentals, I mean, I send a few DC Amps to my brain every time I go to do anything electrical with my car because I forgot to disconnect, or trying to disconnect my battery.
The amp is stable down to 2 ohms. It can actually run at 150 watt per channel @ 2ohm.
@ 4ohm = 4x75
@ 2ohm = 4x175
@ 4ohm MONO = 2x300
I thought the questions was pretty straight forward. If amp is sending 4 ohm power, to a 2 ohm driver, will there be problems?
The way I see it is that I am screwing a 60 watt lightbulb into a 100 watt lamp. The bulb will work, it will only be as bright as 60 watts can put to it.
I'm not that good with elecricity fundamentals, I mean, I send a few DC Amps to my brain every time I go to do anything electrical with my car because I forgot to disconnect, or trying to disconnect my battery.
10-21-2003, 08:48 AM
#6
The amp will see whatever speaker load is placed in line with it, it cannot send 4 ohm power, when the speaker is presenting it with a 2 ohm load. If you already tried running it bridged before and it didn't like it, you might have to look to other subs, or another amp maybe. Hope this helps, someone correct me if I am wrong here.
10-21-2003, 12:25 PM
#7
2000 Watt CAFz'r
Join Date: Jan 2001
Posts: 2,026
Amps do NOT send an impedance load. Amps do NOT run 4ohm or 2ohm power. Amps simply send power. The rating of ohms on an amp means it can handle pushing a 2 or a 4 ohm load without blowing up.
Whatever the speaker load is, is the load the amp will see. Its like saying I can lift 100 lbs with one are and I can lift 200 lbs with both arms. If you give my one arm 150 lbs I will pull a muscle, but if you give both of my arms 150 lbs I will have no problems.
The same with Amps -> just the lower the ohm load, the heavier the weight will be on the amp. so 1 ohm would be like 400 lbs, 2 ohm -> 200 lbs, 4 ohm -> 100 lbs. So don't give the amp more weight than it can handle.
In your case, the amp can handle a 2 ohm load when it is not bridged (4 channels stereo). but once it is bridged, the lowest it can handle is 4 ohms (2 channel).
Since your amp cannot run 2ohm bridged (Yes, I know that your amp says it is 2 ohm stable, but it is only 2 ohm stable in stereo - once you bridge the channels, you combine their power and the 2 ohm stability for 4 channels becomes 4 ohm stable for 2 channels). So since your amp cannot run 2 ohms bridges, do not Bridge your amp! You will over work it (IE give it a 400 lb load when it can only lift 200 lbs) and your amp will become a BBQ if you bridge it and run one coil per channel.
You have two options:
1 - Bridging two channels (when bridged it puts out 300WRMS to a single channel) and wiring the speakers in series so the amp sees a 4 ohm load (Before trying this make sure you know the difference between wiring in series and wiring in parallel) But since the speakers are wired together, they will have to share that 300 watts so each speaker will only get 150Watts
2 - Leave the amp unbridged. The amp produces 150WRMS x 4 into 2ohms. Each woofer would still get the 150 RMS, but there would be less THD, and you could use the other two channels for a front stage etc.
I hope this makes sense. If you have any questions about this, please continue to post.
Whatever the speaker load is, is the load the amp will see. Its like saying I can lift 100 lbs with one are and I can lift 200 lbs with both arms. If you give my one arm 150 lbs I will pull a muscle, but if you give both of my arms 150 lbs I will have no problems.
The same with Amps -> just the lower the ohm load, the heavier the weight will be on the amp. so 1 ohm would be like 400 lbs, 2 ohm -> 200 lbs, 4 ohm -> 100 lbs. So don't give the amp more weight than it can handle.
In your case, the amp can handle a 2 ohm load when it is not bridged (4 channels stereo). but once it is bridged, the lowest it can handle is 4 ohms (2 channel).
Since your amp cannot run 2ohm bridged (Yes, I know that your amp says it is 2 ohm stable, but it is only 2 ohm stable in stereo - once you bridge the channels, you combine their power and the 2 ohm stability for 4 channels becomes 4 ohm stable for 2 channels). So since your amp cannot run 2 ohms bridges, do not Bridge your amp! You will over work it (IE give it a 400 lb load when it can only lift 200 lbs) and your amp will become a BBQ if you bridge it and run one coil per channel.
You have two options:
1 - Bridging two channels (when bridged it puts out 300WRMS to a single channel) and wiring the speakers in series so the amp sees a 4 ohm load (Before trying this make sure you know the difference between wiring in series and wiring in parallel) But since the speakers are wired together, they will have to share that 300 watts so each speaker will only get 150Watts
2 - Leave the amp unbridged. The amp produces 150WRMS x 4 into 2ohms. Each woofer would still get the 150 RMS, but there would be less THD, and you could use the other two channels for a front stage etc.
I hope this makes sense. If you have any questions about this, please continue to post.
10-21-2003, 01:44 PM
#8
50 Watt CAFz'r
Thread Starter
Join Date: May 2003
Posts: 204
Gotcha. Now I know why I got a lot mroe kick out of my subs and my amp overheated.
Theres no way to cheat is there? No special way of wiring, like joining together 2 channels with a Y Adapter for a sub to use all the channels is there.
Like I said, N00b. I am good when it comes to most thing, but this whole ohm and electricity stuff drives me up the wall. I am really just curious on how the exact same equipment would perform differently in pretty much the same setup... only difference was his was a SUV.
Theres no way to cheat is there? No special way of wiring, like joining together 2 channels with a Y Adapter for a sub to use all the channels is there.
Like I said, N00b. I am good when it comes to most thing, but this whole ohm and electricity stuff drives me up the wall. I am really just curious on how the exact same equipment would perform differently in pretty much the same setup... only difference was his was a SUV.
10-21-2003, 01:49 PM
#9
2000 Watt CAFz'r
Join Date: Jan 2001
Posts: 2,026
Sorry, no cheats available. Something like a Y adapter (if it is what I think you're thinking) will short out the amp.
Yup, You got it. When you bridge it and run 2ohm bridged, you will get more power but it will be short lived, because you will over work the amp. It sounds like you are lucky enough that your amp has a protection mode to prevent it from becoming a BBQ.
As for sounding good in one car and not in the next: There is something called cabin gain, which I don't know much about. The cabin of the vehicle makes a huge difference on the output.
Try different positions for the sub box - facing rear/side/front/up/down (anything you can imagine) and hear how that effects your output.
Yup, You got it. When you bridge it and run 2ohm bridged, you will get more power but it will be short lived, because you will over work the amp. It sounds like you are lucky enough that your amp has a protection mode to prevent it from becoming a BBQ.
As for sounding good in one car and not in the next: There is something called cabin gain, which I don't know much about. The cabin of the vehicle makes a huge difference on the output.
Try different positions for the sub box - facing rear/side/front/up/down (anything you can imagine) and hear how that effects your output.
10-21-2003, 02:22 PM
#10
50 Watt CAFz'r
Thread Starter
Join Date: May 2003
Posts: 204
Ah ok. Maybe I port my Box (I think Dukk has a audo search for new posts with "Ported".
Now this is what is funny: I am only sending 30% of the potental power to my subs and they are killer.
Time to find a 2 ohm: 2 x 500 Amp, or.. if I wire in parallel (just have the 2 positives, and 2 negatives running to same terminal) find a 1000 watt 1 ohm Mono Block Amp?
[ October 21, 2003, 03:32 PM: Message edited by: Fuzz ]
Now this is what is funny: I am only sending 30% of the potental power to my subs and they are killer.
Time to find a 2 ohm: 2 x 500 Amp, or.. if I wire in parallel (just have the 2 positives, and 2 negatives running to same terminal) find a 1000 watt 1 ohm Mono Block Amp?
[ October 21, 2003, 03:32 PM: Message edited by: Fuzz ]
