u would guess that wouldnt u? by same reasoning if u play 72hz note why do u need any xovers and processors to begin with? only 72hz would go to your subs, thus no need for any filtering, or signal processing?

Tinted is happy that George is finally happy

Because I was saying that Alma used Phase modules and they have nothing to do with x-overs or voltage.

you said knowone used processors, I say then what were those for :confused:

Still havent answered that :D

full range amps and speakers. that was answered with a pic already.

umm, no, I know what they were used for,hint for you Tinted, it was a before there were flat walls install, it had 64 tens.

im guessing they ran those full range things off the same amps as they did the subs without any crossovers or anything?

I am talking about the phase shift things, is that what you are talking about? Because they weren't for the mids.

George remembers being told that the high end speakers in her truck never worked and was only there to add credibility to one of her sponsers which was Real Player.

George knows what the processors were used for in her truck. Georges post was simply that she did have processors.

full range speakers worked fine in the truck, they played music with them at db drag finals.

O.K. but what about the phase controllers, why oh why could they be there?

Slow/n\low thinks that tinted has only been around car audio for a few years and doesnt realize alma gates had been with PPI back in the day, and that he doesnt know what a phase shift is

lol u tell me why they are there then??? if u only send a specifid hz to your sub u dont need anything else with respect to processors, this is by your own reasoning. so why would u need a phase controler

no i have no clue what phase shifters are

[ March 19, 2004, 12:45 AM: Message edited by: Tinted ]

tell me what a phase shifter is and what it does

Well, when subs are different distances from the mic what happens to the sound wave at the mic?

[ March 19, 2004, 12:54 AM: Message edited by: DWVW ]

so are u saying that u are to contradict your previouse statement?

on the pressure sensor nothing happens to the sound wave at the mic if subs are reasonably close to the mic. i've also tried this test with my sensor in my very own car. place the mic anywhere on the windshiled while moving the boxes from side to side, still get VERY similar score every time, with in 0.3 db.

What if the subs are not an equal distance from the mike by a significant distance?

How am I contradicting myself?

say wha bro?

doesn't the phase shifter just invert the signal being amplified by that particular amp? You need these to run multiple amps on single woofers. For example to run four mtx 81000d's on one rfl you need the Lsx2 crossovers so that you can perform the operation of inverting the signal by 180 degrees. This allows you to put one amp per post on the dvc woofer. With the amps on the negative posts put 180 degrees out of phase. Makes two push and two pull. This is a pain in the ass so now the new 1501d's have the phase shifter built in as the remove the LSX2. Yes, I believe derrik is right on the pahse shifter about the sound wave when it hits the mics. If the sound start a point A and travels to point B by going from low to high pressure. What would happen if you inverted the signal it would start at a different point and hit the windshield at a different point. I may be wrong but when sound travels it resembles a sinusoidal wave i believe. Reflection has a lot to do with it too i think.

I could also be far off so iff anyone has any input let me know it is the only way to learn [img]graemlins/thumb.gif[/img]

The LSX2 will not invert a channel, that's what you need to do to run multiple amps on a single coil.

On ALma's install, to fit 64 subs the box was not a flat wall, the Phase shifters allowed you to adjust the phase (not just 180 which you could just flip the polarity with the speaker wires) but infinitely up to 180 degrees I believe. She used the phase shift controllers to ensure all sound waves were in alignment at the mic position

Good night, back at this thread tommorrow [img]graemlins/thumb.gif[/img]

cool dereck! i knew it was something like that. Thanks for clearing a little bit of that up for me. [img]graemlins/thumb.gif[/img]

Tinted, I was asking about why you would need crossovers because I don't know. Obviously they have a use in SPL, I have found a quite a few cars that use them. I am a SQ guy so I was hoping you could shed some light on the subject for me. I do know that processor's are used in SPL. In the one and only SPL vehicle I built it was pretty simple. I just measured from the Sub to the mic position, took a quarter wavelength, and used that frequency, we then made a removable port, when a comp came to town we made three runs, one with the port we originally made tuned to the quarter wave, one an inch shorter and one an inch longer, the inch shorter one was louder so we cut made the long one another inch shorter and it was quieter so we went with the inch shorter than original and did 144.7 or something with an off the shelf MTX T81244A and a Rockford 501bd in an extended cab Chevy s-10 with no sounddeadening or anything. That's it, never tried it before or after that. So I was looking for some enlightenment from you

Yes Derek understands :D

So now I hope that we all understand that we can be wrong

Moral of the story "processors are used in SPL"


[img]graemlins/thumb.gif[/img] the end......

yah i guess i overshot myself, 'processors' are used but signal boosters and eq's are not.

i could be wrong but im yet to see an spl vehicle that uses symmetry, and im not talking about something from the far past. i wanna see something recent.

George agree's that DWVW got the explanation correct on the Phase Shifter. People infact have used those for other speakers then subwoofers.

George knows that a signal booster aka line driver is also called a processor.

The funny thing again tinted is that the orignal post had nothing to do with SPL.


His question was not who uses them in SPL, he just wanted opinions on the product [img]tongue.gif[/img]

not once did anyone ever say that the epx has or was used in SPL or for that matter is good for spl.

Why did you even bring up SPL? I dont see that question in 8 pages?

your answer shall be found on the first 2 pages. let me summarize. the kid asked about the unit, i said a good deck can do it, then someone either u or george said i was stupid and that symmetry is a good unit, i said that i do spl and it's useless to me so i could be wrong. then the rest of this threat went on with u george and dwvw telling me that symmetry along with other processors are used in spl. thats pretty much it? Both DWVW and George had good points and did infact showed me something i wasnt sure about........now i just want to know what is the purpose of your replies? just to keep dogging me? like your last post was totallly pointless, b/c i've already stated (like 2 pages ago) that both George and DWVW were right and i was wrong? so yah, answer me that

George would like to apologize to the original poster for this thread taking on a whole new life. George is amazed that it became a thread trying to educate Tinted.

Yes Tinted I will correct myself, George did say that "if Tinted were smart he would no how the EPX2 could inprove his system and make it louder"

Also what I am confused about is if you are into SPL and the EPX to your understanding is for SQ, then why would you even answer or be involved in the original discussion?

And that fact you said you own an EPX on page 1 and then later down you had to ask for clarification on what the EPX is, makes me think that you dont have one and dont even know what it does.

Now run to a web site and look up the info on the EPX so you can make people think you actually do own one. Cause I call bull****.

now, put together 3 questions is sentence form and I will be happy to answer any of them.

[ March 19, 2004, 11:55 AM: Message edited by: slow/n\low ]

lol i cant answer? i was asking what YOU think EPX is, not what it is overall. i have one i know what it does but i dont use it.

back to my question.....what is the purpose of your replies? u had explained just as much about EPX as i have.

Dude you dont get it.

u got it! i DO NOT get it.

ohhh ya well i still say I [img]graemlins/headbang.gif[/img] can fart 153


so [img]graemlins/2xblown.gif[/img] to that!!

hehe :D

[ March 19, 2004, 04:00 PM: Message edited by: slow/n\low ]

Slow N Low can or can't?

Slow/n\low would like to thank Boominz24 for her correction of the previous post grammer. [img]tongue.gif[/img]

I wasn't correcting I was asking cuz I didnt understand what u meant lol

the phase alignment PROCESSORS in almaS bronco were used to phase align the woofers fathest back in each slot with the woofers in the front of the slots, for lack of a better term for the "box", therefor creating a more phase aligned system, and getting the phase as close to identical in the mic position as possible while not having the woofers in an even remotley close to phase aligned position. the ppi processors allowed her to apply more woofers in a less that ideal alignment application, , pretty damn hard to phase align 64 friggin woofers without them, the first gen bronco was so cutting edge, it was awsome

getting them all aligned is so there isn't a cancellation of waves, or creating a standing wave correct?

yes that right, cancellation can be cuaed by many things particularily phase