Slingshot2, I'm sorry I don't know anyone with those last names.

I"m an anti social snob, and with the exception of this forum, I don't talk to anybody that doesn't have a Sir or Lord in front of their name.

I"m being sarcastic guys.


Adam

 

Ok, I want to take back a bit of what I said about 2-way versus 3-way or try to add to it. And my thoughts are fairly generalized as every car is different and some you can do a lot more with then others. And when I refer to a two-seater car, I mean sounds good from both front seats. One seater means it sounds good from the driver’s side only.

I think both a 2-way and a 3-way can work. BUT, depends on your goals. I think that for a car where you want to make both front seats sound good, 2-way is the only way to go, unless you can do a massive dash/kickpanel reconstruct. If you’re trying to create a one-seater car, 3-way can be easier to pull off, but also more expensive.

A 2-way can be extremely hard to nail and can take a lot of time and effort in some cars. It can be difficult to install 2-ways location wise in some vehicles to get optimum placement. Some cars are just the sh!tz for sticking a 6.5” or even a 5.25” driver and tweeter in kicks and getting them to sound good from 80 all the way up to 20K. But if you can get them placed right, tuning is pretty much a breeze.

On the flip side, in a 3-way system install can be simplified, unless you are trying to jam all 3 drivers into kick panels ………. YIKES!!! But putting a 4” and tweeter into kicks with a 6.5” or 8” into the doors usually is fairly easy. But then you have to tune them, with 3 different point sources. That can be a lot more challenging then a 2-way setup optimally positioned (for a two-seater car). And usually the midbass driver in doors is not optimal as PLD is very important in this frequency range. Hmmmmmmmmm, I’m just going to copy here what Mark Eldridge said as he generally knows what he’s talking about and I agreed with him with this 100%………….. I ‘m not going to make it sound like I made this up. These are Mark’s words. Here it is:

So with that being said, in a 3-way setup, you can nail the mid and tweet fairly easily, but the midbass driver is hard to get when installing in the doors….. especially if you are creating a two-seater car. For a one seater, hello time alignment in the midbass range!!!

Hope these thoughts may help [img]graemlins/thumb.gif[/img]

 

I agree with your points now of why a 2-way can be superior to a 3-way. Tuning is a key issue. For what Mark said, if you run your 4" down to 125 (of which any decent 4 can handle) then having the midbass in the doors shouldn't be a problem. Now seeing that, some of my problems may have been because the xover points on my passive 3-way xover are at 400 and 3500 Hz. The 400Hz and down frequencies are going to my door midbass, when it sounds like they should be crossed at around 125. On my new setup, I'm going all active which will really make it easier to tune once the system construction is done.

 

I've found that you almost must have an active processing system to work out the bugs in an install. Otherwise your hands are pretty tied. If I ever find more money to blow, I want to try a 3-way setup with tweet/5.25"mid/6.5" or 8" midbass. Not to start throwing out brands, but I'd really like to give those DLS Iridium 8" components a go and add in a 5.25" to work as a mid range. The Iridium 8" components come in a 2 and 3 way setup, but in the 3-way setup, the mid is a dome and heard bad things about the dispersion characteristics of it.

Was interesting about what you said about 4". I have a set of 4" Audax at home and recently checked the specs and they did not play low at all. So I guess it important that one also checks the specs on the drivers as well........ prior to laying out cash.

One other thing I'd like to throw out. A lot is said about demo-ing speakers. This is a good thing. BUT, you also have to take into account the installation of the speakers when making a decision. Are they on a board or in a car.......... two totally different setups. Also, if in a car, were they installed properly and with proper planning??? Like I've said before, I've heard talented installers make junk sound like gold and had wannabe's demo me golden gear, tell me how awesome it sounds while I'm sitting there wondering WTF because it sounds like garbage!!! So ask questions to yourself and to the person/place demo-ing the gear for you. Make sure you understand the setup (where parts are placed, how they were installed, x-over points, active or passive, power, etc, etc). I think it's important.


Gawd damn I type like a madman [img]graemlins/freak.gif[/img] Good thread though.

 

I've never yet demo'd a speaker that I've bought IMO, demoing speakers on a board is almost useless. You can compare the sound of it to others in the board, but that's about as useful as it gets. I look at specs and frequency response plots, but even that doesn't really tell you how it will sound in the car. I would think that going to shows and listening to speakers in the car, especially in the same car you have, is probably the most useful but even then how that particular car is tuned could make it sound different too. Way too many variables.

 

Well????

 

Are you talking about a track to play so that you can properly install tweeters ??? Track 12 and I think it's 18 (drum beats?!?!) is always fun. But the best thing to do is listen to music on some of the other tracks. Pop out the liner and it has a lot of instructions that will help you. But make sure you set up your mids first. Mid are the most important to nail down.

 

I have read that placing the tweeter in the centre of a small bridge built over the midrange driver will also help.

 

^ That's coaxially mounting. Lots of competitors do this if their nice component set doesn't come in coax form. Dukk routered a really slick aluminum bridge for a kick panel set that never got done for my Dakota R/T before I sold it.

 

SUX, does placing the tweeter directly on top of the midrange driver make a noticeable difference for the better ???