Sounds like the words of an Eclipse dealer [img]tongue.gif[/img] </font>[/QUOTE]I personally would take an 8 series over the P9 combo just because I dont wanna have to deal with a huge exterior processor and I believe that the eclipse will sound more natural and clearer than the pioneer. Everyone has there own opinion but saying im biased is stupid. Yes I love my eclipse HU, but if you can show me something available on the north american market that sounds better than an 8 series eclipse without the need for an external processor and doesnt cost $5000 then I would be suggesting that unit. </font>[/QUOTE]Lol Chris you clearly are biased. You always reccomend Eclipse no matter what. Also, you said you believe the Eclipse would sound better and clearer, when you've never used those specific Pioneer pieces. If you haven't used the pieces that you're comparing the Eclipse unit to, then it is not a fair, or accurate comparison. </font>[/QUOTE]Jonhy, just because I support eclipse doesnt mean I am biased. I support them because they produce a very reliable product that is at the top of the market right now in terms of quality for the money. I know I havent used the P9 but I would bet the eclipse would sound better.

A pioneer deck is still a pioneer deck no two ways about that. They make some nice decks but in terms of SQ they arent close to eclipse.

 

Well said.

 

Sounds like the words of an Eclipse dealer [img]tongue.gif[/img] </font>[/QUOTE]I personally would take an 8 series over the P9 combo just because I dont wanna have to deal with a huge exterior processor and I believe that the eclipse will sound more natural and clearer than the pioneer. Everyone has there own opinion but saying im biased is stupid. Yes I love my eclipse HU, but if you can show me something available on the north american market that sounds better than an 8 series eclipse without the need for an external processor and doesnt cost $5000 then I would be suggesting that unit. </font>[/QUOTE]You are in fact biased. Every time Eclipse is mentioned on this board you are all over it. Lets hear a comment on the problems Eclipse decks have had such as the turn on problems with the 8443 that are being discussed on ECA right now.

Furthermore, you can pick a P9 up for far less than 5 grand. The DEQ P9 is not huge, it is fairly compact actually. It has far more processing ability than the Eclipse by itself. I can't believe you are even comparing them on the same level. The P9 can do so much more than the Eclipse unit, and it should since it costs more. I am by no means saying the 8053 isn't a great deck, but it simply isn't on the same level as the P9. </font>[/QUOTE]Like I said, show me something that doesnt require an add-on processor or doesnt cost $5000(F1 status) and then we can talk. Yes I bet the P9 has tons of tuning capabilities when paired with the add-on processor, but that doesnt mean its gonna sound the same as an eclipse. I am not gonna go and suggest something I havent used or that I know doesnt work. Eclipse is an amazing product and I stand behind them 100%.

About the turn on thump problem, thats not even an issue when you look at the amount of problems every other deck company has. How about alpine motorized faces wearing out and breaking?

I dont jump all over stuff where eclipse is mentioned, if someone asks a question about eclipse I will put in my .02 just like you do. Sorry for trying to share my knowledge of eclipse stuff with other people, didnt know public forums banned people expressing there opinions.

 

Here is another link about several skipping problems Eclipse decks have encountered.

http://forum.elitecaraudio.com/showt...threadid=87141

 

Sounds like the words of an Eclipse dealer [img]tongue.gif[/img] </font>[/QUOTE]I personally would take an 8 series over the P9 combo just because I dont wanna have to deal with a huge exterior processor and I believe that the eclipse will sound more natural and clearer than the pioneer. Everyone has there own opinion but saying im biased is stupid. Yes I love my eclipse HU, but if you can show me something available on the north american market that sounds better than an 8 series eclipse without the need for an external processor and doesnt cost $5000 then I would be suggesting that unit. </font>[/QUOTE]You are in fact biased. Every time Eclipse is mentioned on this board you are all over it. Lets hear a comment on the problems Eclipse decks have had such as the turn on problems with the 8443 that are being discussed on ECA right now.

Furthermore, you can pick a P9 up for far less than 5 grand. The DEQ P9 is not huge, it is fairly compact actually. It has far more processing ability than the Eclipse by itself. I can't believe you are even comparing them on the same level. The P9 can do so much more than the Eclipse unit, and it should since it costs more. I am by no means saying the 8053 isn't a great deck, but it simply isn't on the same level as the P9. </font>[/QUOTE]Like I said, show me something that doesnt require an add-on processor or doesnt cost $5000(F1 status) and then we can talk. Yes I bet the P9 has tons of tuning capabilities when paired with the add-on processor, but that doesnt mean its gonna sound the same as an eclipse. I am not gonna go and suggest something I havent used or that I know doesnt work. Eclipse is an amazing product and I stand behind them 100%.

About the turn on thump problem, thats not even an issue when you look at the amount of problems every other deck company has. How about alpine motorized faces wearing out and breaking?

I dont jump all over stuff where eclipse is mentioned, if someone asks a question about eclipse I will put in my .02 just like you do. Sorry for trying to share my knowledge of eclipse stuff with other people, didnt know public forums banned people expressing there opinions. </font>[/QUOTE]We are not talking about Eclipse and Alpine here. We are directly comparing the P9 combo and the Eclipse 8053. You say show you something that doesn't require an add-on unit. Well that isn't the point of this thread now is it. The DEX P9 was designed to work with an add on processor. The DEX P9 is basicly meant to be a Transport.

The 8053 is a stand alone unit and is meant to be used as such. You say it is cheaper which is true, and for someone that doesn't require the tuning capabilities, the 8053 would do great. For someone that competes and is willing to spend some extra $, the P9 stomps all over the 8053.

But as you say in your last post, the Eclipse isn't comparable to the P9 since the P9 requires a seperate processor and costs more. This is my main point. The Eclipse 8053 just isn't in the same class as the P9 combo. You implied in an earlier post that the 8053 is better than the P9, which is the reason I got into this.

Compare the DEH 940 to the Eclipse 8053, and then you have a point. However, the gentlemen was asking about the P9 versus the 8053.

 

Wow, nice biased links, seems that every Tom, Dick and Harry with an issue let the world know about it. This is no different than having a bad meal or a pair of shoes that don't fit. Anyone can find something to whine about when it comes to any brand of cd player, no company is immune to this. But to those that are close minded, that is on their shoulders, not those that can look at things from a different perspective.
Here is something to chew on.
1992-1994 Sony CDX5040 and CDX5080 had severe skipping issues. And any Sony made unit like Blaupunkt.
1990-1992 Alpine first generation detach faceplates volume issues.
1988-1994 Pioneer power supply issues
2000 Panasonic faceplate bulbs
? - 2004 Blaupunkt code security
? - 2004 Kenwood motorized face failures
The fact is that if there is a turn on thump problem with the cd player it has nothing to do with sq and yes Eclipse should and will address it, but a good installer can solve the problem.

 

Wow, you obviously do not get my point. I am by no means saying Eclipse is a bad choice. I gave those links because you claimed you had never heard of such problems. And some of those members are quite knowledable (Leon Shing for example), not quite Tom, Dick and Harry as you suggest. I was merely showing you that Eclipse is not without problems. The fact is, Eclipse makes great decks. I won't argue with that. But the plain simple fact is that the Eclipse 8053 IS NOT IN THE SAME CLASS AS THE P9!!!! It is as simple as that.

Why won't you admit that? Oh I forgot, you are an Eclipse dealer. You call me close minded? PFFFFFFF whatever man. I admit Eclipse is an awesome choice and I would consider using the 8053 to be honest. But be a man and admit the P9 is in a class above the 8053. However, you probably won't do that since since it is you that is close minded and fail to look at things from a different perspective.

[ February 27, 2004, 06:51 PM: Message edited by: Kool ]

 

Yes, but Eclipse's skipping issues have been fixed for 4 years just to clarify.

I love eclipse decks(have used 4 different models over about a 10 year period), but I have not heard a p9 combo(would love to sometime).

For a new deck for US$549, I think the Eclipse cd8053 is a very strong competitor though.

Can it compete with a p9 combo which costs quite a bit more?.....I dunno

I guess for the more budget inclined competitor, the eclipse might be the way to go. If you have the cash, maybe the p9 is THAT much better, I dunno.

As much as I love eclipse decks(I have owned clarion, pioneer, kenwood, and alpine as well), if I had the cash, and a p9 combo sounded better to me, I would buy one. [img]smile.gif[/img]

[ February 27, 2004, 06:53 PM: Message edited by: PerryB ]

 

Yes, but Eclipse's skipping issues have been fixed for 4 years just to clarify.

I love eclipse decks(have used 4 different models over about a 10 year period), but I have not heard a p9 combo(would love to sometime).

For a new deck for US$549, I think the Eclipse cd8053 is a very strong competitor though.

Can it compete with a p9 combo which costs quite a bit more?.....I dunno

I guess for the more budget inclined competitor, the eclipse might be the way to go. If you have the cash, maybe the p9 is THAT much better, I dunno. </font>[/QUOTE]Well stated [img]graemlins/thumb.gif[/img]

 

I agree that Eclipse has had it's share of problems, just like any other, for info on the P9, let me ask my Pioneer rep about info that the average Joe does not have access to.
If you want to compare apples and oranges that's fine, but I can almost guarantee that the dollar difference between your comparison could yield far better sq with the dollars spent on better speakers and installation over a band aid, anyday. Leave the processor out of the issue and show me how on earth the Pioneer is better, make me a believer. I may be a business owner but I am still willing to learn. Does Pioneer have a magic new laser and transport that converts audio to a magically better state or is the fact that the same laser sled is used as the bottom of the line unit?