4 way Active
02-06-2011, 05:40 PM
#41
by same slope, do you mean if i'm using a 24db on on one end, use a 24 on the other?
does this apply to all preouts, or simply on the affected preout?
would it do well to have a much steeper HPF than LPF?
for example, the transition between door woofers and midrange.
a shallow upper slope for the woofer so it isn't such a quick transition between the two, and a much steeper bottom slope on the mid to protect the mid and allow it to play slightly lower.
woofer @ 18db HPF
mid @ 36db LPF
does this apply to all preouts, or simply on the affected preout?
would it do well to have a much steeper HPF than LPF?
for example, the transition between door woofers and midrange.
a shallow upper slope for the woofer so it isn't such a quick transition between the two, and a much steeper bottom slope on the mid to protect the mid and allow it to play slightly lower.
woofer @ 18db HPF
mid @ 36db LPF
02-06-2011, 07:02 PM
#42
kind of a technical question here.
i'm just trying to get a grasp of phase shifts and their effect.
so a phase shift as a result from a crossover point will only affect the frequencies within that affected passband.
phase shifts cannot be heard outside of this overlap because there is no reference. (since only one driver is playing)
with each degree of crossover, a 90degree phase shift occurs.
if two drivers each undergo 90degrees of phase shift, there will be severe cancellation at the crosspoint.
(a 24db is a good starting point since it provides a 360 shift and minimizes cancellation)
so theoretically (because i know a every car is unique), if you were to take distance out of the equation and presume all drivers are firing from the same distance, would desirable results be achieved by employing crossover slopes of appropriate cutoff, but equalling 360 degrees of shift between HPF and LPF?
for example.
sub: 12db HPF
low: 36db LPF (12+36 = 720...=360)
low: 12db HPF
mid: 36db LPF (12 + 36=720...=360)
mid: 18db HPF
high: 6db LPF (18 + 6 = 360)
by desirable I mean would most cancellation be avoided, as well as summing? all the while allowing for an appropriate cutoff to protect drivers on the low end, while allowing nice transition into the next driver on the upper end?
i realize that the distance between each driver will skew the shift, but is this an accurate understanding before incorporating distance???????????
...and can distance can simply be accounted for using time alignment can it not? (i know ideally PLD's should be the same between each driver...but its not a perfect world)
i'm just trying to get a grasp of phase shifts and their effect.
so a phase shift as a result from a crossover point will only affect the frequencies within that affected passband.
phase shifts cannot be heard outside of this overlap because there is no reference. (since only one driver is playing)
with each degree of crossover, a 90degree phase shift occurs.
if two drivers each undergo 90degrees of phase shift, there will be severe cancellation at the crosspoint.
(a 24db is a good starting point since it provides a 360 shift and minimizes cancellation)
so theoretically (because i know a every car is unique), if you were to take distance out of the equation and presume all drivers are firing from the same distance, would desirable results be achieved by employing crossover slopes of appropriate cutoff, but equalling 360 degrees of shift between HPF and LPF?
for example.
sub: 12db HPF
low: 36db LPF (12+36 = 720...=360)
low: 12db HPF
mid: 36db LPF (12 + 36=720...=360)
mid: 18db HPF
high: 6db LPF (18 + 6 = 360)
by desirable I mean would most cancellation be avoided, as well as summing? all the while allowing for an appropriate cutoff to protect drivers on the low end, while allowing nice transition into the next driver on the upper end?
i realize that the distance between each driver will skew the shift, but is this an accurate understanding before incorporating distance???????????
...and can distance can simply be accounted for using time alignment can it not? (i know ideally PLD's should be the same between each driver...but its not a perfect world)
Last edited by jstoner22; 02-06-2011 at 07:21 PM.
02-06-2011, 08:17 PM
#43
You don't need to add the slopes. Each slope is separate and should be treated that way. Even in a bandpass filter.
You are correct that each 6db increase changes the phase by 90 degrees.
Cancelation can occur and that is a problem, but with car audio we also need to consider how T/A will effect phase. Its all related.
You are correct that each 6db increase changes the phase by 90 degrees.
Cancelation can occur and that is a problem, but with car audio we also need to consider how T/A will effect phase. Its all related.
02-06-2011, 08:26 PM
#44
lol, i know its all related, now i just want to understand it.
is cancellation the primary concern when worrying about phase shifts?
and if so, you say not to add the slopes. however, i don't quite understand.
if you were to have a 90degree shift in one direction and a 540 in the other on a pairing of HPF and LPF, would this not result in both drivers being in phase?
if a HPF/LPF pairing don't affect one another, how can you correct it?
is cancellation the primary concern when worrying about phase shifts?
and if so, you say not to add the slopes. however, i don't quite understand.
if you were to have a 90degree shift in one direction and a 540 in the other on a pairing of HPF and LPF, would this not result in both drivers being in phase?
if a HPF/LPF pairing don't affect one another, how can you correct it?
06-11-2012, 10:29 AM
#45
just took a few pics and thought i would throw them up here for all to see!
i never got around to it before, so here is what i ended up having done after much discussion in and out of this thread.
i never got around to it before, so here is what i ended up having done after much discussion in and out of this thread.
06-12-2012, 08:57 AM
#47
very nice! been interested in getting a set of L3SE myself.. used to run the mlk165 as well but couldnt stand the tweeters in general in a 2 way set up.
midbass was fantastic and have yet to see many midbass that dig as low as them with authority at all volumes!
midbass was fantastic and have yet to see many midbass that dig as low as them with authority at all volumes!
06-16-2012, 02:11 PM
#49
nothing too nasty.
little 0.5-1db cuts throughout the spectrum to balance L/R
the only thing bigger than that is 1.5-5khz, with the cut peaking at 2.5khz.
all of the drivers are on axis, minimizing reflections as much as possible.
06-16-2012, 02:12 PM
#50
if you have the means to do so, definitely give it a try! if you run active, it isn't hard to integrate with the other drivers.
