the car audio industry
04-24-2004, 11:56 PM
#21
Guest
Posts: n/a
My ramblings - some of which have been mentioned.
Average systems are way different. Used to be once you got a cutomer past just a CD player they moved to better front speakers, a sub, and amplification all around. These days I see way to many decks running stock or $79 coaxials and a 1000watt Class D on a big sub system in cars. IMO your average car stereo system sounds worse now than 5 years ago because of this.
Although it varies by location, in my area there is a larger between "basic" and "advanced" systems. There are not that many people with say 300-400 watt systems with a decent set of comps and a woofer. Either it is bare basics or lots of gear (again mostly focused on boom as noted above). I blame it on rampant crime. Average joe gets hit once and says forget it or is too scared to spend too much in the first place.
Power is cheap. As a result woofers are inefficient and need big power - leading to the rampant boom crap systems I seem to be harping on
Video has degraded sound quality overall. Dude has $1500 so he buys a $700+ headunit, a sub and sub amp and well if there is a little left over maybe some coaxials. Then since there is an obvious $700+ headunit in the car it gets stolen and guy says forget it altogether. As you can see all these points are loosely related so far.
There is MUCH more "marignal" gear available now. Internet manufacturers and direct sales has spawned this market. Conversely, quality gear is better than ever - you just need to find the right people to tell you which catagory Brand X is..
Misinformation and "new product hype" causes too much confusion to new enthusiasts. This makes it harder for professional sales and install staff to educate people.
The only thing that remains constant is that if you buy from a reputable manufacturer now that was a reputable manufacturer 5 years ago, you will get good value. The exceptions to this are very few.
Average systems are way different. Used to be once you got a cutomer past just a CD player they moved to better front speakers, a sub, and amplification all around. These days I see way to many decks running stock or $79 coaxials and a 1000watt Class D on a big sub system in cars. IMO your average car stereo system sounds worse now than 5 years ago because of this.
Although it varies by location, in my area there is a larger between "basic" and "advanced" systems. There are not that many people with say 300-400 watt systems with a decent set of comps and a woofer. Either it is bare basics or lots of gear (again mostly focused on boom as noted above). I blame it on rampant crime. Average joe gets hit once and says forget it or is too scared to spend too much in the first place.
Power is cheap. As a result woofers are inefficient and need big power - leading to the rampant boom crap systems I seem to be harping on
Video has degraded sound quality overall. Dude has $1500 so he buys a $700+ headunit, a sub and sub amp and well if there is a little left over maybe some coaxials. Then since there is an obvious $700+ headunit in the car it gets stolen and guy says forget it altogether. As you can see all these points are loosely related so far.
There is MUCH more "marignal" gear available now. Internet manufacturers and direct sales has spawned this market. Conversely, quality gear is better than ever - you just need to find the right people to tell you which catagory Brand X is..
Misinformation and "new product hype" causes too much confusion to new enthusiasts. This makes it harder for professional sales and install staff to educate people.
The only thing that remains constant is that if you buy from a reputable manufacturer now that was a reputable manufacturer 5 years ago, you will get good value. The exceptions to this are very few.
04-25-2004, 06:19 AM
#22
Guest
Posts: n/a
its really intersting to hear everyones point of view, i think the indusrty is healthy, in general, but volatile it just seem that more stores are closing (at least in western canada, not sure abou the east)a store will invest a tone of time and cash into a installer and he turns around, thinks he can make a fortune, opens his own shop and goes **** up in a year, a familiarr story out west at least. i truly hope the days of manufacturers teams comes back,(the fun days imo) it seems like were all trying to go that direction, i think that it could really breath new life into car audio organizations like iasca etc, and it just me or does it seem that guys are switching teams(stroes) at an alarming rate, storea today, b in 4 months, it seems that an indusrty that when i started was built on loyalty(ive seen fistfights beteween guys defending there stores in the old days) is gone, do you think those days will ever come back
04-25-2004, 06:49 AM
#23
no those days of loyalty will never ever come back. car audio industry and market have grown way beyond that now. do you see two guys one from futureshop and another from 2001 audio/video fighting? lol that would be funny tho
as far as manufacturer and shop teams go, those are alive in well in Db Drag as far as i can see.
as far as manufacturer and shop teams go, those are alive in well in Db Drag as far as i can see.
04-25-2004, 07:53 AM
#24
50 Watt CAFz'r
Join Date: Apr 2004
Posts: 143
Fist fights?? Not anymore. We come here to extrude testosterone now. And if you have a guy who buys a decent deck, then gets it ripped off, who then says screw it all together, that is the fault of the place that sold him the deck for not emphasizing how important an alarm would have been to protect that investment. Again with the misinformed sales force. The sale is never over untill the customer is educated on everything he/she is going to need.
04-25-2004, 08:12 AM
#25
Well well well.. where do I get started? First off, I beleive in general customers have gotten cheap. Most people instead of going for warrenty and service, they want the cheapest price, but then when something goes wrong they'll throw a hissy fit. I can see this more and more everyday, everyone wants a deal and it just doesn't work that way.
I agree with tinted about the politics and bull****. There are some things just aren't right. If anyone wants an example, at a show a few years ago someone from a different shop showed up just to watch, he said hello to one of the reps for a product which both shops carry, the rep told him he shouldnt talk to him because of the situation.
There are more and more know it alls. People that go on the internet read about hyped up products and hype them up more, without even using them or seeing them in use.
As for as competitions go, I beleive they have had a drip, but are back on a rise.
Stay tuned for more later! [img]smile.gif[/img]
I agree with tinted about the politics and bull****. There are some things just aren't right. If anyone wants an example, at a show a few years ago someone from a different shop showed up just to watch, he said hello to one of the reps for a product which both shops carry, the rep told him he shouldnt talk to him because of the situation.
There are more and more know it alls. People that go on the internet read about hyped up products and hype them up more, without even using them or seeing them in use.
As for as competitions go, I beleive they have had a drip, but are back on a rise.
Stay tuned for more later! [img]smile.gif[/img]
04-25-2004, 08:15 AM
#26
Guest
Posts: n/a
he clubconcept, maybe we could set up a ring in your parking lot, anyone youd like to go a round with, hahaha, i cant remeber who it was , but i was at a show in victoria and some guy from foss in tacoma, duked it out with some a&b'er, laffed my *** off, those were the days, thats loyalty, you insult my store, i kick your ***, now if you insult a store, they offer you a job, lol
04-25-2004, 12:39 PM
#28
As a retailer I have noticed many things. The most significant however is the fact that most brands build to hit a price point instead of performance or quality. Not to say that this is bad, but it was market driven by the customer who wants the $129.00 cd player that the dealer has to sell it to him at cost, so in one sense the customer is bending over the retailer to get what he wants.
The manufacturer however is making things cheaper every year in order to maintain marketshare. The industry has grown to probably the biggest it has ever been, for every 10 new companies every year, there are 10 that do not make it. Most manufacturers can no longer hit their quotes for growth through their distribution channels, see the thread about e-tailers and grey marketers.
The manufucturer can no longer grow their business in the traditional fashion, that is building a good reliable product that is distributed to a loyal dealer base, they are now interested in primarily the all mighty $ as they must make their business grow. No doubt about it, they are not in business to make stereo gear, they are in business to make money. They are now doing things a little different, if they cannot sell more product, they buy up companies that sell product and keep the retained profits. Maybe they build to hit the OEM and take business away from aftermarket. A good case in point here is that Rockford Corporation wanted to grow. They had pretty much plateaud with their sales to retailer, so they announce to us that they have signed a deal with Nissan to provide Rockford gear to select Nissan vehicles. Now again no doubt here, if it works, expect to see even more Rockford gear in even more Nissan vehicles - this takes $ away from the retailer and places those $ square in the pockets of the manufacturer. How long will it be before Bose - no highs - no lows - just Bose loses their agreement with GM in favour of Alpine or Pioneer for example?
What else did Rockford Corporation do to grow after they saturated the retail market? They bought up companies to make themselves even more money, in the last five years they have bought Lightning Audio, MB Quart, Q-Logic and others. Not that this was a bad move, but it shows how one company must change their way of doing business in order to grow. In some ways to the retailer it is a good move, in other ways it was bad.
When FS (sorry to you FS guys) took on the Rockford line, most of the indipendents dropped it. It was dropped by some because they did not feel they could compete (those guys were wrong) or it was a slap in the face or something else offered better value. Sure FS could move boxes, no doubt, but I as a retialer of Rockford put way more out my door than the local FS ever will. All Rockford did in Canada by doing this is trade dollars from the indipendant retailer to the big box retialer, maybe it is easier for them to flush away excess product, well sure it is with such a distribution system that FS has. Rockford's #1 retialer in the US is Best Buys, wonder how Best Buys is related to FS, all that Rockford did was place their eggs in one basket and secured for themselves a set sales target, a smart business move any way you look at it.
Business is always changing in Canada, it is up to the retailer to change with it.
[ April 25, 2004, 01:43 PM: Message edited by: MR2NR ]
The manufacturer however is making things cheaper every year in order to maintain marketshare. The industry has grown to probably the biggest it has ever been, for every 10 new companies every year, there are 10 that do not make it. Most manufacturers can no longer hit their quotes for growth through their distribution channels, see the thread about e-tailers and grey marketers.
The manufucturer can no longer grow their business in the traditional fashion, that is building a good reliable product that is distributed to a loyal dealer base, they are now interested in primarily the all mighty $ as they must make their business grow. No doubt about it, they are not in business to make stereo gear, they are in business to make money. They are now doing things a little different, if they cannot sell more product, they buy up companies that sell product and keep the retained profits. Maybe they build to hit the OEM and take business away from aftermarket. A good case in point here is that Rockford Corporation wanted to grow. They had pretty much plateaud with their sales to retailer, so they announce to us that they have signed a deal with Nissan to provide Rockford gear to select Nissan vehicles. Now again no doubt here, if it works, expect to see even more Rockford gear in even more Nissan vehicles - this takes $ away from the retailer and places those $ square in the pockets of the manufacturer. How long will it be before Bose - no highs - no lows - just Bose loses their agreement with GM in favour of Alpine or Pioneer for example?
What else did Rockford Corporation do to grow after they saturated the retail market? They bought up companies to make themselves even more money, in the last five years they have bought Lightning Audio, MB Quart, Q-Logic and others. Not that this was a bad move, but it shows how one company must change their way of doing business in order to grow. In some ways to the retailer it is a good move, in other ways it was bad.
When FS (sorry to you FS guys) took on the Rockford line, most of the indipendents dropped it. It was dropped by some because they did not feel they could compete (those guys were wrong) or it was a slap in the face or something else offered better value. Sure FS could move boxes, no doubt, but I as a retialer of Rockford put way more out my door than the local FS ever will. All Rockford did in Canada by doing this is trade dollars from the indipendant retailer to the big box retialer, maybe it is easier for them to flush away excess product, well sure it is with such a distribution system that FS has. Rockford's #1 retialer in the US is Best Buys, wonder how Best Buys is related to FS, all that Rockford did was place their eggs in one basket and secured for themselves a set sales target, a smart business move any way you look at it.
Business is always changing in Canada, it is up to the retailer to change with it.
[ April 25, 2004, 01:43 PM: Message edited by: MR2NR ]
04-25-2004, 03:06 PM
#29
500 Watt CAFz'r
Join Date: Mar 2004
Posts: 923
The sale is never over untill the customer is educated on everything he/she is going to need.
I worked hard and spent hard earned money to get to the level I am at now. I am NOT going to just give that information away free to every customer I meet and not put food on my table or pay the bills by only helping 1-2 clients a day. I do not leave them ignorant but give them the basic gist of what they need to know. If they want details I will most definately tell them what they need to do to attain that knowledge. They can do it themselves, they have the ability.
Sales people have to sell the product that fulfills the wants/needs/desires of the client and move on to the next customer. I agree that a level of understanding is required but if any customer blamed me for their equipment being stolen because I didn't tell them to buy an alarm then I would literally tell them to blow it out their ***. Welcome to the real world. My stuff gets stolen or has the risk to be stolen as much as the next guy. You want to blame anyone, blame the lax laws that "punish" (yeah right) the theives and hamstring the victims.
If the customer requires that much information then maybe they should research over the internet or take the necessary courses. How do you think people in the industry get started ?
Real world experience has cost (probably) everyone on this forum many paychecks, scraped knuckles, smashed fingers, sleepless nights and long hours. I respect anyone who has put in the time to get to where they are.
BTW Sorry for the long winded, semi-rant. I hope I didn't come off as an ***. I didn't intend it.
Like I said before, This is a great post. I enjoy keeping tabs on it.
[ April 26, 2004, 12:26 PM: Message edited by: Lethal ]
04-25-2004, 03:24 PM
#30
500 Watt CAFz'r
Join Date: Mar 2004
Posts: 923
Well well well.. where do I get started? First off, I beleive in general customers have gotten cheap. Most people instead of going for warrenty and service, they want the cheapest price, but then when something goes wrong they'll throw a hissy fit. I can see this more and more everyday, everyone wants a deal and it just doesn't work that way.
Consumers are demanding lower prices every year and the only way manufacturers can do this is to cut corners, use cheaper materials, lesser quality workmanship etc....
Look at VCR's 10 years ago. You probably paid 500-800 dollars for it. Does it still work? Probably. Does it weigh a ton? Most likely. Could you drop it out a window and would it still work? Definately. Those old tanks were built like the proverbial brick ****house. The new models now have dozens of extra features. They're about as small as a shoe box, weight in the ounces and are so inexpensive they are practically disposable.
And people wonder why I almost scoff when customers get mad when the unit breaks or stops working after 14 months. Sure....it should be troublefree but can you honestly expect it.
There is a reason why retaillers offer extended warranties. I really don't like telling a client (regular or 1st time), that there is nothing I can do because the manufacturers 1 year warranty has expired and they declined the extended in store warranty. I recommend them to everyone whether they buy from my store or F.S., A&B, Sight&Sound etc.....It's relatively cheap peace of mind unless you physically break it or liquid damage it. You can't expect anyone to replace something you dropped/mishandled, right?
I always liken warranty problems to automobiles. It's a very expensive purchase and think what the dealership would do if you had a problem with your new car a few months down the road. They would fix it if it weren't abuse but do you really think they should give ya a new one?
If you said yes, then give your head a shake and come back to reality.
Once again rant mode off and fire retardant suit on. Flame away if ya don't agree.....
