Subwoofer brands, please explain this to me ..................
01-21-2005, 10:42 PM
#41
50 Watt CAFz'r
Join Date: Nov 2003
Posts: 237
There's only a few things I want to say on this subject.
Firstly, I had two Rockford Fosgate Punch HX2 12s with 1000 watts, ported. I switched to a single Elemental Designs 15A with 800 watts, and it was louder and sounded twice as good, while costing over $200 less.
Secondly, there are a lot of companies, other than "basement brands", who outsource their manufacturing. Eclipse happens to be one of them, and their speakers are built by the same people who used to build eD subwoofers. And they are not built overseas. I don't think it's important whether the parts came from overseas or not.
Thirdly, I agree that there is an irritating sense of elitism throughout most of the forums, as people are so quick to look down on any mainstream product. People seem to forget that these companies are capable of making good products.
Lastly, I think it's the price of brand-name gear that puts most people off. They can get a top-of-the-line 15" Adire Audio sub for $500, or a top-of-the-line JL for $1200.
Firstly, I had two Rockford Fosgate Punch HX2 12s with 1000 watts, ported. I switched to a single Elemental Designs 15A with 800 watts, and it was louder and sounded twice as good, while costing over $200 less.
Secondly, there are a lot of companies, other than "basement brands", who outsource their manufacturing. Eclipse happens to be one of them, and their speakers are built by the same people who used to build eD subwoofers. And they are not built overseas. I don't think it's important whether the parts came from overseas or not.
Thirdly, I agree that there is an irritating sense of elitism throughout most of the forums, as people are so quick to look down on any mainstream product. People seem to forget that these companies are capable of making good products.
Lastly, I think it's the price of brand-name gear that puts most people off. They can get a top-of-the-line 15" Adire Audio sub for $500, or a top-of-the-line JL for $1200.
01-22-2005, 01:05 AM
#42
500 Watt CAFz'r
Join Date: Mar 2004
Posts: 820
For me price is the main factor.
You said that the main brands are more expensive, well in Ontario it is completely opposite. I can get a woofer from an internet based company for about 300 canadian dollars after shipping, taxes, duties, brokerage fees etc and it easily compaires to a much more expensive speaker that a lot of main companies have.
I'm not saying that this is the case everywhere but here in Ontario, the price per performance ratio is not in favour of the retail stores.
Stores in general are a waste IMO. I go to my local shop, and while I support them with anything I can justify buying from them, that is often limited to RCA's and fuses. I can get any of the products they sell for well under 1/2 price online which is sad. Now this buying of mainstream brands online is what gave me the knowledge of the underground brands and it all manifests from there.
Just my opinions,
Craig G
You said that the main brands are more expensive, well in Ontario it is completely opposite. I can get a woofer from an internet based company for about 300 canadian dollars after shipping, taxes, duties, brokerage fees etc and it easily compaires to a much more expensive speaker that a lot of main companies have.
I'm not saying that this is the case everywhere but here in Ontario, the price per performance ratio is not in favour of the retail stores.
Stores in general are a waste IMO. I go to my local shop, and while I support them with anything I can justify buying from them, that is often limited to RCA's and fuses. I can get any of the products they sell for well under 1/2 price online which is sad. Now this buying of mainstream brands online is what gave me the knowledge of the underground brands and it all manifests from there.
Just my opinions,
Craig G
01-22-2005, 08:28 AM
#43
^ we are not compairing online to retail !
Although ED might not sell in retail stores, other 'basment brands' do....
You can also buy many mainstream brands from authorized online dealers and get a nice discount over retail.....
Although ED might not sell in retail stores, other 'basment brands' do....
You can also buy many mainstream brands from authorized online dealers and get a nice discount over retail.....
01-22-2005, 08:58 AM
#44
Guest
Posts: n/a
Firstly, I had two Rockford Fosgate Punch HX2 12s with 1000 watts, ported. I switched to a single Elemental Designs 15A with 800 watts, and it was louder and sounded twice as good, while costing over $200 less.
Boolean - your statements are simply disturbing.
Toolman - that's kind of a shame that not one single store treated you how you felt you needed to be treated.
SO what has been learned? People tend to buy "Basement Brands" because they like exclusivity, can find niche market products, and believe they are saving money over large market brands.
Interesting for sure.
01-22-2005, 10:05 AM
#45
I dont think the so called basment brands are necassarily niche markets.....
Most of the companies mentioned thus far (big or small) have products ranging from entery level to high end....
Adires entery level might be alot higher end then say kenwoods.... but that is not to say that kenwood, kicker, MTX, ect ect ect hasnt taken a shot at building a so called 'super woofer' or multi-KW amplifier ether...
I think %80 of this discussion is as simple as generic VS brandname.... grocery shopping might be a good anology... any one else ever notice that quite often a cheaper no name product is the exact same a brand name ??????
Difference = advertising + promotion, and perhaps greater profit margin with the brand name.....
Most of the companies mentioned thus far (big or small) have products ranging from entery level to high end....
Adires entery level might be alot higher end then say kenwoods.... but that is not to say that kenwood, kicker, MTX, ect ect ect hasnt taken a shot at building a so called 'super woofer' or multi-KW amplifier ether...
I think %80 of this discussion is as simple as generic VS brandname.... grocery shopping might be a good anology... any one else ever notice that quite often a cheaper no name product is the exact same a brand name ??????
Difference = advertising + promotion, and perhaps greater profit margin with the brand name.....
01-22-2005, 11:07 AM
#46
Umm no, because it's cheaper and for the price, outpreforms it's retail counterparts.
I'm sure from your posts that you work for future shop. At my local FS I noticed an MTX woofer, $349.99. SVC 4 ohm, 200 watts power handling. For that price online you can afford a woofer that will out preform that in terms or power handling, and perhaps a choice of voice coils to suit your application better.
This is what we're talking about, price vs performance. It's not a knock against you because you may work at a big box store.
[quote]Originally posted by Dukk:
I'm sure from your posts that you work for future shop. At my local FS I noticed an MTX woofer, $349.99. SVC 4 ohm, 200 watts power handling. For that price online you can afford a woofer that will out preform that in terms or power handling, and perhaps a choice of voice coils to suit your application better.
This is what we're talking about, price vs performance. It's not a knock against you because you may work at a big box store.
[quote]Originally posted by Dukk:
SO what has been learned? People tend to buy "Basement Brands" because they like exclusivity, can find niche market products, and believe they are saving money over large market brands.
Interesting for sure.
Interesting for sure.
01-22-2005, 11:55 AM
#47
And then there is just the people who think outside of the box. JL, RF, MTX are not the only car audio manufacturers in the world. And for the price of a JL 500/1 and W7 you can buy more power and better sound for less through a manufacturer that does not charge a premium just for the JL name. The "cult" or following of people as you refer them to, are the people that didn't get sucked into the "BIG BOX" brand and advertising and relize that "I can buy better equipment, better sounding equipment, more power delivery or handling for less." Not to mention if anyone bought the same equipment. We would all be the same. No individuality. And there is something about toasting the guy beside you with the $10000 system by 10db with your $4000 system. No everyone gets sponsored and not everyone makes $100000 per year.
Cheers'
Cheers'
01-22-2005, 04:09 PM
#49
I hear what you are saying. And I don't doubt that they do sound great. The compvr's though are a fairly affordable sub. I'm talking about $1400cdn for (1) W7???? and $700-800 for a L7???? Like someone said yes there is entry level product in all brands. And for that money I could by 3-5 different sub brand that would out sound, out power, and overall out perform and still have money to start my amp fund. Thats what I am talking about. Iam sorry if I didn't clearify.
Cheers
Cheers
01-22-2005, 04:14 PM
#50
1000 Watt CAFz'r
Join Date: Jun 2004
Posts: 1,024
its funny the way a lot of people on car audio forums feel about these basement brands is completely opposite of a lot of people that dont use these forums. in my small town, if its not RF, Alpine, Kenwood, its complete garbage. people have no idea of these small companies, and laugh at you if you even mention Adire, RE or whatever the company may be.
just an interesting little thing i noticed.
just an interesting little thing i noticed.
